Was release moved?

One more thing I did not mention. The balance in the first game was neglected and the only one multiplayer mode was very punishing and discouraging but instead of fixing it, another one was added that only split the already low population of the game. The game was quite quickly abandoned too. making DLC, that only effected in deepened the problems and offered only short burst in player numbers, was of higher priority than changes that could keep people with the game. I do not see anything that suggests that they may do something different this time. Adding 3 times the number of fleets then it was in the first version of the game do not base for much optimism in that regard. Actually most of us do not know anything of value about the actual gameplay. Only a few saw the gameplay. Is it such impossible and costly to give description of how aspects of the game are going to look like? Especially if they were confident enough to give an estimated release date and put the game on preorder?

last edited by Grey Seer

@grey-seer said in Was release moved?:

@Alandauron Those restrictions that developer may have or not are the fruit of the deal between developer and publisher. If there is such agreement it means that both sites agreed to ignore customers who are paying them. Painting developers as some "victims" of the system is a missed shot because they agree to all of this.

Never tried to paint them as a victim, just mentioned there may be some legally binding agreement to not share much or any information without approval. They would have agreed to it for one reason or another, usually because they want to get funded, and now have to live by it. I also didn't say this was the reason but rather that it could be the reason. Still nothing to get so upset about.

@grey-seer said in Was release moved?:

And how much would it cost to make a post on the forum once a week? With 2-3 screenshots maybe, even marked as work in progress.

Well I don't pretend to know much about the costs of development or someone to talk with angry/happy/oblivious fans/consumers but off the top of my head I would say that it could get pretty expensive to pay someone that is good with PR to make posts that don't reveal things that aren't guaranteed or anger fans in some way.

@grey-seer said in Was release moved?:

Maybe answer for a few questions?

Here's where things could likely get expensive. Who's questions do you answer? What if you answer the questions of someone that is oblivious or happy and ignore the person that gets angry, like you? It's not as simple as just answering, the person has to have knowledge of all aspects of the development or be handed information by someone that does. Also they have to be wary of haters that will get angry about things that most consider little things, like you have.

@grey-seer said in Was release moved?:

Somehow they have resources for journalists (selectively picked ones as far as I know the game industry).

Really? You KNOW this? What are your sources, I'd like to know this as well. I suggested that they were releasing some information to journalists as a way to get some media coverage as an alternative to your conspiracy theory because whether you like it or not there are other reasons that companies do things besides to spit on fans.

@grey-seer said in Was release moved?:

Vacation, illness, fires... floods, hurricanes, whirlwinds, heats, snowstorms, strikes... And why should we care about such things when we do not know anything about it? They do not care about informing us about such events, if such took place, if they assumed from the beginning that we, simpletons, are not able to comprehend such situations.

You can hate on them all you want, I am merely trying to give you some reasonable things to consider. Ignore it and continue being completely unreasonable if you choose, doesn't bother me any.

@grey-seer said in Was release moved?:

What delays do you speak of? There are no delays for now as far as I'm aware of. We can doubt it or not but there is no delay to speak of.

Exactly, we don't know of any delays because they keep it all in-house. Some companies prefer this.

@grey-seer said in Was release moved?:

It is hard to estimate what they will deliver in relation with what they have promised because they did not promise that much and nothing recently and they are completely silent about anything form months. Maybe they haven't done anything "misleading". But What they have done at all? No information for months, the release is planned for the next month, people still do not know what they are exactly buying and everything is in the best order somehow?

Yea, I have no problem with this. If they have done nothing at all they will get some sells from those who enjoyed the first iteration and then even those people will refuse to buy anything that follows this game. A developer that just resells the same game without at least a minimum effort to change things up doesn't remain a profitable developer. That would be an instance of being misleading, they are making a second version of the game that is being sold on the assumption that something has been improved upon. If nothing is improved and the game is not enjoyable then they will lose sales in the future. Also they have a closed beta going on right now and those people would be talking if the game had produced nothing new.

@grey-seer said in Was release moved?:

Ignoring customer's questions and concerns for months

They haven't ignored, they have answered multiple times, just from a few basic searches, that "They are not ready to reveal more information or answer those questions" This isn't the same thing as ignoring, to ignore would be to not answer at all. Just because you're upset that you don't get what you want when you want it doesn't mean you are being ignored. Are you a child? I only ask because these are the kinds of things I have to educate my child about.

@grey-seer said in Was release moved?:

bragging about inviting the "chosen ones" to events

LMAO! They never did this. When asked about what kind of presence there would be at Gamescon they responded by saying it would be public and only for journalists. Crying about not getting any information or the chance to play for free at Gamescon is not a big deal.

@grey-seer said in Was release moved?:

when the community is "starving" for any information

Yea, I am too. The difference is I am also realistic and look at things from other perspectives rather than just my own selfish interest, unlike you.

@grey-seer said in Was release moved?:

My main problem is that this game in on preorder and they do not give any information about it. It doesn't matter if I can choose to not buy it. It is available and it should mean something. If it wasn't in preorder I could have some worries and a little surprised but they would not pull anyone into their machinations and it would be somewhat fair. Preorders, and even more, early accesses are rot in this industry that allows selling pigs in pokes. Quality and thus customers are only losing on that, and crooks are gaining.

Legitimate concern and something I battle with every time before I decide to pre-order anything. So I came up with my own solution to this problem in order to avoid getting bent out of shape when a game releases and is a complete pile of garbage and I actually pre-ordered it. I only pre-order games in which the developers have produced a game that I enjoyed and got a ton of play time in.

  1. If it was a good game and I got 120+ hours and the game was $60 then any follow ups to that game become an auto pre-order.
  2. If it was a good game but I only got about 20-30 hours and it was a $60 game I won't pre-order again but will watch future games from the developer and after they release likely wait for a sale.
  3. If it wasn't a good game I won't buy from the developer ever again and I begin to question any publisher that is connected with the game.

@grey-seer said in Was release moved?:

Yesterday I was talking with my friend who works for developers. And he says that he can't come with another branch that does such things as the game industry does and he would like to see some sort of regulations because there are none, for now, they do what they please. Releasing uncompleted products, why not? Deception and lies in the bright day, let's not talk about it. Treating customers like a nuisance, Why not? Fanboys will minimize the impact of those who do not agree to this and when you will invite "the right journalists" even the media will be in order. This industry will not change until we, the customers will not change.

So this is it, you're on a crusade. Good luck, but honestly you should spend your time on the big publishers and developers that deliver rehashed pieces of garbage constantly. I have seen so many "boycott this" people on the web and they usually end up playing those games more than most others even though they were so adamant about boycotting them. Trolling the forums of people wanting to know more information about a game they are waiting for isn't helping your case though. Yes, you are trolling.

I merely wanted to give you a different perspective to think from, but if you don't want to that's fine. Getting mad for no information is silly. Getting mad for being misled is reasonable. There has been no misleading information released thus far so I still say your level of rage is unnecessary. Good luck to you. As for me I see no further reason for this discussion to continue.

@grey-seer said in Was release moved?:

One more thing I did not mention. The balance in the first game was neglected and the only one multiplayer mode was very punishing and discouraging but instead of fixing it, another one was added that only split the already low population of the game. The game was quite quickly abandoned too. making DLC, that only effected in deepened the problems and offered only short burst in player numbers, was of higher priority than changes that could keep people with the game. I do not see anything that suggests that they may do something different this time. Adding 3 times the number of fleets then it was in the first version of the game do not base for much optimism in that regard. Actually most of us do not know anything of value about the actual gameplay. Only a few saw the gameplay. Is it such impossible and costly to give description of how aspects of the game are going to look like? Especially if they were confident enough to give an estimated release date and put the game on preorder?

you know, since this is all info that is already out there i considered spoon feeding you
its already revealed so technically i am allowed
even had it all typed out
but F it
WATCH THE DAMN REVEAL VIDEO
WATCH THE DAMN INTERVIEUW
WATCH THE DAMN FACEBOOK PICTURES CLOSELY
if you want info, do some damn effort
or do you need the devs to send you their diary in PMs, will probably still not be enough since they dont come to your house and read them to you as bed time stories
there have already been discussions on the damn forums discussing if their attempts to balance things and change the game mode are a good idea
but nope, you didnt read because your too busy ranting
just take a long walk off a short cliff

last edited by Ashardalon

Well here we can see that our politicians are right treating us like a bunch of idiots. Indeed we are reading the comments...

Do you know "Deeds matter more than words"?

After 8 months you have exactly the same like the 1st one so you will get exactly the same. Instead of having a little bit of self respect and send this guys directly to hell you are here begging for crumbs giving them the ONLY think they want: YOUR MONEY! and the funny part is now they dont even have to say a word!

Acting like this no wonder how the world is so fucked. you dont have memory and you dont have self respect. You only care about getting it no matter how bad they are treating you before even if they are spitting in your face...

@matacucasraid chill dude,

thindalos not giving infos on the game is sad but not the end of the world, it's not someone spiting in your face

or saying '' if you dont like my game dont buy it '' like some other publisher BF5*

they talked alot about their aspiration for the game, showed just ennough to back their aspirations with videos, lets not forget the game has 3 time the content than the first one at release

wait for open beta to begin or some other marketing stuff that can turn your mind. no one is forcing you to buy stuff

@ashardalon if this was not a pre order game i would agree with you but when they took peoples money i would argue they are at least somewhat obligated to give status reports. As for the information already out there it does nothing to answer the questions that are related to balance and other things they got wrong or neglected in the first one. Teaser trailers are fun but and that interview was informative to some degree but that was hard pre alpha game there and a month out we should be hearing something about final product.

@imptastic actually does address most of the things causing balance problems in the first
if they will work is a hard question to answer
but the solutions they thought to make it possible to balance are out there
i think they will work but what do i know
ofcourse im not going to mention the actual closed beta balance because NDA and because pointless because beta but the concepts that caused balance issues have the concepts to solve them out there already in those first videos
like they should because concepts are for pre alpha, if you are making concepts in beta something went wrong

and they didnt take anyone's money
people gave them their money
the discount is even available after the open beta is out so its not even that they try to bait you into paying with a discount thats only for pre beta release
its all your decision if you pre order
if you disagree with that you shouldn't pre order and wait for the beta, im sure there will be youtubers covering it so you can make a more informed decision
from what i have seen i am happy i pre ordered, have nothing to fear and cant wait to get the open beta because im going cold turkey over here
game will be godemperor damn great, prettymuch an improvement on every aspect of the first and more

@imptastic no one is obligated to pre-order, you do so because you think the game will be good or that you will enjoy it. Tindalos is not obligated to provide any information until the game releases, it's just what many people have become used to, even if the information provided doesn't always end up in the release product. Myself and many others would rather not be given information that may or may not reflect what you actually get so we pre-ordered because of other reasons.

Still I also agree that I would like to know more, I'm just not so pampered to believe that it is owed to me. I know that if the release game is garbage I can get a full refund from Steam so long as I don't spend a huge deal of time in the game prior to asking for said refund. I miss the old days when you got a demo released along side the game and advertising was not often invested in, not nearly so many pampered children whining cause they didn't get their way.

first of all i did not pre order as i saw this coming from how they handled information on the last game even well after release. As for took, accepted, gave money its all semantics lol you know what i meant by that. As for them being obligated obviously they are not as if they were there would be some frivolous law suit already filed on it but as i said prior i would argue they are, as it is incredibly bad form to accept money for something then not keep those that paid, donated, or any other phrases you guys wanna come up with and not give at the very least status reports. you guys can defend this till your blue in the faces its still not gonna make what they are doing any less disrespectful to all the people that gave them money.

@imptastic why are you getting outraged for other people?
i preordered and am happy
you didnt so why are you complaining about the preorders?

and the took, accepted, gave are relevant because one of those gives the blame to someone who shouldnt be blamed while the others are an expression of free will and responsibility
the words are completely different
in no way are they synonyms like entitled bitches might try to imply

Umm im not outraged. My commentary is in support of those that are outraged. As for the took accepted gave argument it only holds water if the company put out a disclaimer saying they had no interest in engaging with the community as a whole over this. Its not unreasonable to expect information on a product you purchased i don't frankly understand how you could think it is. as for complaining about preorders im not im just stating that if they want to set it up for preorders they should make with the info if they wanna keep it tight lipped then they dont have to allow, enable, promote, advertise preordering and no one would have a legit argument for being outraged there is no consistent status report releases. As it stands now the people that brought the product don't even know when its going to be releases and its supposedly a month away. Side note the reason the information from the interview and teasers is not valid is simply because they wont confirm anything thing they mentioned is working. Lofty ideas are great but without confirmation they are just ideas.

@imptastic but those others also didnt preorder
so same question
why are you getting outraged for people for who it isnt relevant

they need to write a bot to repeat the same message every minute or else the status reports arnt consistent enough!
spoiled brat

@ashardalon monthly even every 2 months would be consistent enough in my mind but hey im just a spoiled brat! seriously man u just resorted to name calling and you up in my business about being outraged on a forum.

should have probably used plural
but still accurate enough

@ashardalon im like rubber your like glue whatever you say bounces off me and sticks to you!

last edited by imptastic

@imptastic said in Was release moved?:

you guys can defend this till your blue in the faces its still not gonna make what they are doing any less disrespectful to all the people that gave them money.

It's not disrespectful to not share information. It's disrespectful to share false information. What they are doing is preventing the spreading of false information because things may still be in flux or because they may be under their own NDA. Just because you [or the others that have also not pre-ordered] are personally offended doesn't mean you have been disrespected by any measure.

@imptastic said in Was release moved?:

As for the took accepted gave argument it only holds water if the company put out a disclaimer saying they had no interest in engaging with the community as a whole over this.

What kind of backwards logic is that? They haven't announced anything, why do they have to announce something to claim that they didn't want to announce anything? Your arguments are ridiculous and childish.

@imptastic said in Was release moved?:

Its not unreasonable to expect information on a product you purchased i don't frankly understand how you could think it is.

Umm...yes it is. It's not unresonable to hope for news the way myself and others are. It IS very much unreasonable to expect something that was never promised or guaranteed to you and further to take to calling someone disrespectful for not giving you what you expected despite never having been promised anything.

@imptastic said in Was release moved?:

As for took, accepted, gave money its all semantics lol you know what i meant by that.

Yes, I know exactly what you meant by it, you meant to accuse them of doing something that is morally wrong when in fact they have not. Pre-ordering is something that goes on with pretty close to 100% of games today. You might be able to say with 100% of games if you include the Early Release as pre-ordering as well. It's not semantics when the two things are not the same at all. Allowing people that want to the chance to offer support while they are doing some finishing touches is not the same as reaching into your wallet and taking the money out. Especially since it's exactly as Ashardalon stated.

Not sure about the game, guess what there's gonna be an open beta that many of us will be playing because we want to, just wait for some reviews and streams of the game, which will be out on the day of release most likely, and if you don't like what you see then forget about this game. If they happened to do a decent job and fixed at least some of the major issues with the first iteration then make the purchase, you'll still get the discount and even some "beta" time before the game is fully released. That's actually pretty generous if you ask me.

Once again, I see no reason for any outrage from what Tindalos has done with BFG:A2 up to this point. Now, this may change after release and if so then I will have no problem admitting I was wrong, I just don't think that's going to happen. There's companies with actual terrible release policy that deserve all your effort, Tindalos is not one of them at this point.

Pre-order customer here, with this being only the second game I've pre-ordered based on how much I enjoyed the first.

Perhaps it's because I'm from a time when your first contact with a game was when it landed in the shops on a cassette, and the only time you'd hear from a developer was in a rare magazine interview. Now people expect to be spoon fed information on an almost daily basis. Companies like Blizzard/EA do this, however look how much time they have to spend defending themselves from the players when they do and the fallout when they say stupid shit (I'm looking at you EA). Would you rather have the guys at Tindalos on the forums/social media having two way conversations with us, or be at their desks making the game?

Add in any contractual obligations they have with Focus on what they can and can't say. I'd imagine many of the players that have played the alpha/beta would also love to talk about what they've seen, but like Tindalos they're under an obligation.

Sure they could talk to us more, however that would take them away from making the game. As a pre-order customer I'd rather they were at their desks doing what they do best, making a top notch 40K game.

TL/DR: happy pre-order customer here who's happy that the development team is working on coding the game rather than making social media posts.

some would certainly or do certainly want that two way conversation im not in that camp honestly i would like to see some posts some time saying how things are going would not take them more than 10 mins to write a short tidbit on how the game development is progress.. i.e. Got the new models up and running for the dark eldar they look great cant wait for you to see them in game. Having some balance issues working them out but everything is on track. I know september is right around the corner looking like the release will be late septemberish. I mean its not too much to ask for periodic statement. they dont have to respond to questions afterwards or anything. As for what you wrote Alandauron i dont even read parsing posts they are generally smug and taking things out of context if you want to make a solid point just do it.

last edited by imptastic

As to why they keep things close and are quiet, check out Cyberpunk 2077's Twatter shit storm today...

https://twitter.com/cyberpunkgame/status/1031930291772899329

@imptastic said in Was release moved?:

I mean its not too much to ask for periodic statement.

Nope, and it's also not disrespect to not give periodic progress updates. You can ask, doesn't mean they are in any way responsible for providing it, nor should they be attacked for not providing it.

I only did my post the way I did to respond to individual points separately, if you're too lazy to read over it then it's not my responsibility to cater to you. It wasn't smug nor did it take anything out of context, but whatever you need to tell yourself to feel superior, enjoy.