Has the TTK been increased? if so... why?!

@alexblonski Sir, would it be possible to add an option to have every enemy bot in local play equip heavy armor? This would let the community test the TTK without the hit registration issues and give better feedback.

I have made a thread asking this here: https://forums.focus-home.com/topic/28894/important-suggestion-add-an-option-in-local-play-for-the-every-enemy-bot-to-equip-heavy-armor

last edited by Slazenger

@benz because you have to hit 5 shots to kill someone with heavy armor? its that simple. you still miss a lot on single fire. so at medium range and lower full auto is still better. I just love how you have the ability to block out 50% of your brain capacity. its amazing.

@croox said in Has the TTK been increased? if so... why?!:

@benz because you have to hit 5 shots to kill someone with heavy armor? its that simple. you still miss a lot on single fire. so at medium range and lower full auto is still better. I just love how you have the ability to block out 50% of your brain capacity. its amazing.

and you want a lower TTK so that tactic is even MORE viable? nice.

P.S: gj constantly getting verbal...says a lot 🙂

last edited by Benz

@benz im getting verbal because i have explained the same thing to you about 20 times. so the verbal thing is the only thing that keeps me going. its how i amuse my self. And this is what i want:

  • Revamp on weapon recoil and sound, they should feal powerfull.
  • If not AP rounds are coming i would like on light amor to be 1-2 shots kill with 5.56 and up. higher caliber will one shot at longer range. and bigger area around torso, for example stomech to make higher calibers better.
  • Remove heavy armor. and as another guy said here. have light armor and shrapnel armor to make you more resistant to grenades and other explosives.

i know all this wont happen but a guy can dream.

@croox why didnt you answer my question? 🙂

@benz i did? if increased recoil and fewer bullets to kill. full auto wont be as viable at medium range. and at closer range full auto will pay off yes. but that as it should be. but single fire will still be viable in aswell. now its not. just go play ins2014 for couple of hours and you will understand. your brain is poisoned be cs and battlefield.

@croox said in Has the TTK been increased? if so... why?!:

@benz ok dude. lets get this down. 2426 shots with 0.24 acc = 582 shots on 153 kills is 3.8 shots average to kill. thanks for evidence to our cause btw.

My god. The TTK in this reply is faster than in Sandstorm. I guess the forum is suffering hitreg issues too because despite the troll being slaughtered he's still going on with himself...

@whitby said in Has the TTK been increased? if so... why?!:

@croox said in Has the TTK been increased? if so... why?!:

@benz ok dude. lets get this down. 2426 shots with 0.24 acc = 582 shots on 153 kills is 3.8 shots average to kill. thanks for evidence to our cause btw.

My god. The TTK in this reply is faster than in Sandstorm. I guess the forum is suffering hitreg issues too because despite the troll being slaughtered he's still going on with himself...

Sorry, i don't fall from airsoft bullets.
Here's the funny thing: you read " thanks for evidence to our cause btw." and think "YAY, SO RIGHT LULZ" .... instead of thinking: "'3.8 shots average to kill' hm, that doesn't say much about TTK! Since the actual TIME factor is not considered here!" No, you don't think that. Why would you :). Otherwise you'd realize that's 350ms for a kill. inb4 somehow trying to argue how 350ms TTK is high. 🙂

Copy pasted this from another TTK thread where I posted: I feel TTK is fine, I drop enemies with 2-3 shots on semi auto all the time. When i get aim on them, they drop really fast. But I havent experienced any hitreg issues either so far. The biggest problem I've had so far is the stuttering/lag, but it felt better yesterday after the hotfix.

It could also be the servers currently have low tickrate settings (can devs give us a number?). Unless the hit registration is improved there is no point in arguing about TTK.

@zefs said in Has the TTK been increased? if so... why?!:

the servers currently have low tickrate

Yeah I forgot about that. What is the actual tickrate in this game?

Some weapons are under powered. I emptied an entire clip from my Uzi on a sniper across the street and he survived. Every shot was dead centre to the top of the chest. I felt cheated and frustrated. It didn't help that I died the minute after to a grenade because I couldn't open a fracking door by running into it and smashing the f key...

@Best-Waifu

I'm in agreement there. SMGs and Pistols seem to have gotten the raw end of the deal in terms of viability.

Personally I haven't had major issues with TTK, but having spent 150-ish hours playing INS2 casually for a year, the game most certainly feels "different" without AP meta. Personally, I find it a refreshing change, but I am in agreement with @Croox in regards to his suggestions to adjust damage and recoil.

In the game's current iteration, the Foregrip is an extremely powerful MUST-HAVE attachment. It significantly reduces recoil on any weapon it's placed on. With the exception of the MK17, G36K, and M16A4, I personally think Security weapons are in a nice spot right now.

G36 is extremely controllable, and is more or less a cheaper M4, while the M16A4 has both the advantages of the recent burst fire buff and the ability to mount decent 1x optics (Something the M16A2 can't, which keeps it balanced.) The MK17 also feels really controllable despite having a beefier fire-rate than the G3, despite being pretty even on the cost scale.

As for the Insurgents, the AKM feels alright, but probably could do with extra recoil. The AK-74 however probably needs to be where the AKM is right now. The thing is a bona fide laser beam.

In regards to total TTK, I'm also in agreement that hostiles without armor shouldn't survive a 5.56 or higher to the chest or stomach regions. An overall damage buff and recoil nerf (read as increase of recoil) to intermediate and rifle cartridge firing weapons. I don't think the recoil nerf should affect SMGs or pistols though. Their ease of use and light weight should be a major selling point, as a player is effectively sacrificing range, penetration, velocity, and straight damage for it.

The other half of this TTK equation is also stemming from two things that players have observed.

  1. Getting shot doesn't stop player momentum as drastically as INS 2
  2. Players accelerate and decelerate too quickly.

These two factors are allowing for a dangerous strafe meta, and makes crossing open terrain much less punishing as players are less likely to be stopped dead in their tracks. I'm fairly certain that if shooting a target dropped their speed drastically for a short period, less people would safely escape firefights.

last edited by Goat Walrus

I think a lot of people are missing the point of armor. Level IV plates can take quite a few rounds of .308 as well as faster rounds with more kinetic energy without failing. SOF dudes are actively training for pelvis and secondarily head shots in the modern day due to armor's increasing prevalence. If you pop someone in the chest in this game without armor using a .308 round they tend to drop quickly. With 5.56 ammunition dudes have taken multiple rounds and kept fighting due to its tendency to "ice pick" through the body, meaning you better be hitting vital organs.

I get some of the frustration with dumping 5-6 rounds center of mass to drop a person, but if reality is the goal it's not far off given the fact that opfor in this game wears armor just like blufor. If anything I would like to see a mechanic where a shot to armor with a rifle caliber round either knocks someone on their butt, which happens in reality not due to kinetic energy but also the shock/startling effect of being shot. If not that, at least a massive flinch where you can no longer stick to your irons or fire effectively, if at all for a short duration.

Just my .02, pretty positive I'll be having fun in this game regardless of the direction they take the damage side.

@benz said in Has the TTK been increased? if so... why?!:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=11tO_LbSEtytGKC6fpuHnInl2-xwWIePw
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1Q15V7vZKfd7rCtQ6riLU1MhDxkD9NnJO
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1GC7Qvd9KRbFT0KWwT3T3k6rzp5dk02A_

Tell me on what planet this is considered high TTK.

Can you actually provide me with some gameplay footage where you think that "high ttk" is present?

If your only reasoning for a lower TTK is "realism" ... we can't have a discussion. I don't give 1 penny for "immersion" or "realism" .... i only care about having a good, modern and competitive FPS game. If you want "immersion" and "realism" there are other games. Milsims. Insurgency is not a milsim.

They go play siege, csgo, or fortnite. . This game is a milsim and people want a good milsim experience. You in the wrong market.

@wistfane said in Has the TTK been increased? if so... why?!:

@benz said in Has the TTK been increased? if so... why?!:
This game is a milsim and people want a good milsim experience. You in the wrong market.

Nice, you don't even know what Insurgency is :). Amusing 🙂

@benz This is clearly not a game for you. You are flaming everythread and managed to piss off plenty of people already. Why is it so hard for you to understand this is not a place and not a game for you. If you want a comp shooter those exist already in the format that you want. You are being an uppity child at this point

@wistfane said in Has the TTK been increased? if so... why?!:

@benz This is clearly not a game for you. You are flaming everythread and managed to piss off plenty of people already. Why is it so hard for you to understand this is not a place and not a game for you. If you want a comp shooter those exist already in the format that you want. You are being an uppity child at this point

Why is it not a game for me? I enjoy it. You are the ones complaining. Nice logic.

Also: the devs want to push competitive in SS... so yeah 🙂 .

last edited by Benz

@sharkva84
I have to disagree with about your entire post.
If we take into account military training, regular soldiers are trained to just shoot the target. Sometimes you train them for the pelvis, more rarely the belly and even more rarely the head. The truth is that soldiers don't have the luxury of nit-picking which area of a target they're shooting at in live combat situations. So training is just about pointing your gun in the right direction and shooting accurately enough to supress a real target in combat. Then sometimes the soldier get lucky and lands a hit at whatever parts his target had exposed. Most killing in war are made by artillery, bombs, shells. Not so much about small arms fire.

So from the get go, insurgency cannot be considered a realistic combat sim game. And, most important and foremost, it's not fun for the player to not be able to kill his targets reliably. It puts chance before skills and never makes you feel rewarded or accomplished for working hard on mastering the game. As other players have pointed out, you cannot take on a group that has the numerical advantage on you because of this time to kill.

If the game is not made for a player's enjoyment, then very few will buy it. I'd hate to see NWI going bankrupt for making this mistake.

@sharkva84 said in Has the TTK been increased? if so... why?!:

I think a lot of people are missing the point of armor. Level IV plates can take quite a few rounds of .308 as well as faster rounds with more kinetic energy without failing.

I think balance should always be prioritized over realism. If the devs are pushing for realism in the armor values they need to drastically change a lot of things to accomodate that, mainly the movement. If we are to have this high TTK we need slower movment. Otherwise the game will be very frustating

last edited by A Former User