Playing ins:source since 2014 (4000 hours). Suggestion for sandstorm (TTK + AREA RESTRICTED + OTHERS)

Hello, I am a casual insurgency player and I started playing the game in 2014. Most of my 4000 hours in the game were dedicated to PUSH mode, although I have dedicated myself to the competitive in recent months and also played THE DGL, by far my preferred mode is the push. Well, I've been eagerly waiting for the release of sandstorm since 2016 when it was first announced by nwi and finally here we are. As I am very fan of the game I would like to leave my opinion about some things in the game.

Here we go:

TTK

At first I would like to talk about TTK which is the thing that most disappoints me in the game.

When I started playing ins: source I was very excited about the game, TTK was what differentiated the insurgency from any other game I had played. The low time to kill is what makes insurgency unique in my perception, few games have fast, hardcore and tactical style like ins: source.

I know that you NWI guys are trying to make a competitive game, but with that change the game loses its essence, I defend the idea that the TTK should be equal to ins: source or at least, lower than the current one.

  • Weapons 7.62 - 1 hit for unarmored, 2 hits for heavy armor

  • Weapons 5.56 - 1 hit for no armor, 2-3 hits for heavy armor

Currently the snipers bolt action are broken, 2 chest shots to kill is ridiculous

Restricted area

Let's talk about the restricted area. I see that few people talk about it here in the forum, but this needs to be reviewed.

Push maps: The restricted area is very close to the objective for the defending team, not allowing players to advance and flank, while the attacking team has complete freedom to flank. I believe that the restricted area should be more flexible and further away from the objective for the defending team. This would make the game more dynamic and fun. I believe this can be done without leaving the protection of the spawn vulnerable.

Coop maps: I think there should be no restricted area in this mode, it is against bot, why remove players' ability to flank bots? It is totally annoying to flank and be blocked by the restricted area.

Firefight and skirmish maps: Restricted area is ok on most maps

It is a bit annoying to play and because I do not know the map well yet, enter the restricted area and the message appears on the screen, I believe that the limit of the restricted area should be added in the minimap, so that the players know how far we can go, just as it was done at ins: source

Volume sound control

Another thing that could be added in the game would be the volume control option of the voice to the character's voice.

I find the characters' cries when they are hurt a bit loud, the same happens when you get tired after running or when someone is flooding the radio chat: "radio", "I need the radio" all the time. With the option to lower that sound the gameplay would be less annoying

Another thing, I'm finding the footsteps much lower compared to beta # 1, sometimes I can not even hear the sound of steps due to overlap with the other sounds

Resuppy points

The resupply points for the push and skirmish modes are very high, I believe that the amount of points must be lowered, at the moment the player can equip all possible equipment of the "shop". I believe that increasing the cost of armor, just as it was done in competitive firefight would also be a good way to balance the game.

Slow gameplay

The gameplay in push and skirmish game modes is very slow compared to ins: source. I believe this is happening because the map is slightly larger and the objectives are scattered across the map. Changing the spawn distance to the objectives, especially in the push, and decreasing the time between the waves could leave the game more frantic.

Vehicles

Cars not very useful in the game, I believe that if you change the amount of shots to destroy them, they would be better. Example: 1 RPG shot to disable it, 2 shots to blow it up

MiniGun and Cannon helicopter support are very strong. Are you guys trying to make a competitive game? Nerf this suport option.

Votekick / vote mute

There are some trolls in the game, increment this option quickly

Optimization issues

Fps drops dramatically when I open my minimap with "TAB" key

I also believe that servers need to be optimized too, I'm playing with 60-80ms on servers that on ins: source would have about 20 ~ 30ms

Stuttering

My game is stuttering all the time after the last update

I have no idea how you guys are wanting to make a competitive, hardcore and realistic game at the same time, it does not make much sense in my head. But anyway do not forget the base of ins: source players before making any decisions. I also believe that we (players of the source) should be more priority at the time of your choice of developers in the development of the game than the possible new players that you can get in the changes in the game.

last edited by Skynet

all very good points and definitely agree. On the issue of TTK I hope that they do not count shooting someone's arm or leg as a body hit because in insurgency: source you could shoot someone's hand once or twice and they would die which was not very fun to be on the receiving end of. I do like the model that you put
"Weapons 7.62 - 1 hit for unarmored, 2 hits for heavy armor
Weapons 5.56 - 1 hit for no armor, 2-3 hits for heavy armor
Currently the snipers bolt action are broken, 2 chest shots to kill is ridiculous"
I also think 9mm should take 3-5 shots to the chest (3 with no armor, 5 with heavy armor)
A .45 should take 2-3 shots. the bolt action snipers are definitely broken and are completely useless.
on the issue of restricted areas I hope they do the same thing for the restricted area as insurgency: source where it has a red tint on the map.

I hope that they add an option to adjust lighting because there are just spots on almost all the maps that are to dark to see anything like certain rooms and corners and is just a darker lighted game overall.

the performance of summit and crossing are still pretty bad especially when supports are used.

Bringing back the red "out of bounds" back to the map would be a large improvement so I don't always run into what looks like great flanking ground only to have my gun magically jammed and defenseless against anyone I see.

That and there are some weird places that are just out of bounds for no reason. Having this visual may help point out the odd spots for fixing.

@skynet Now this is a good post about TTK.

As for the damage model, it was better pre-Sept. 6th patch imo since it was basically what you said anyway, but you are surprisingly tanky without armor. You're only one-shotted by a .308 or above (not counting the SCAR-H). I think pistol calibers should two-shot an unarmored target (which they currently do) and anything intermediate or higher should just put an unarmored asshole down in one hit. Surviving an AKM round to the torso without armor? Yeah, that doesn't happen.

@skynet said in Playing ins:source since 2014 (4000 hours). Suggestion for sandstorm (TTK + AREA RESTRICTED + OTHERS):

Currently the snipers bolt action are broken, 2 chest shots to kill is ridiculous

This puts me off snipers too. The Dragunov however...we have a little thing going on...

@MarksmanMax After the last update came out I did some tests, playing localplay and pvp. I had the impression that when the enemies are distant, the players take much more to die, I believe that there are still problems with the hitreg

@sithis223 have you noticed that equipping a long barrel attachment seemingly increases weapon damage? I don't know if this is valid but it feels like an SVD with a long barrel takes only 1 body shot to incapacitate any enemy.

@skynet said in Playing ins:source since 2014 (4000 hours). Suggestion for sandstorm (TTK + AREA RESTRICTED + OTHERS):

@MarksmanMax After the last update came out I did some tests, playing localplay and pvp. I had the impression that when the enemies are distant, the players take much more to die, I believe that there are still problems with the hitreg

Well, you're correct in that there is damage falloff, but it's not as big of a deal as I think people say it is. Hitreg is better than before but it's still not good at all. Damage falloff probably doesn't happen much with high-velocity rounds, and falloff from 7.62 rounds would realistically only happen past about 100-150 meters, I'd say.

Bolt-action snipers might be broken, but I think the Mosin is perfect damage-wise. I'll test it out later. The M24 is absolute trash, though. The so-called "AP rounds" don't seem to actually penetrate armor lol.

@seven-forty said in Playing ins:source since 2014 (4000 hours). Suggestion for sandstorm (TTK + AREA RESTRICTED + OTHERS):

@sithis223 have you noticed that equipping a long barrel attachment seemingly increases weapon damage? I don't know if this is valid but it feels like an SVD with a long barrel takes only 1 body shot to incapacitate any enemy.

Some weapons that one-shot an unarmored player have noticably different results against armor with a Long Barrel.

At the Volume sound control I also would like to have a option to make guns much louder than it is now. It just don't like real on first person, looks like that they are using a temporary asset.

last edited by Ministro

@skynet said in Playing ins:source since 2014 (4000 hours). Suggestion for sandstorm (TTK + AREA RESTRICTED + OTHERS):

The gameplay in push and skirmish game modes is very slow compared to ins: source. I believe this is happening because the map is slightly larger and the objectives are scattered across the map. Changing the spawn distance to the objectives, especially in the push, and decreasing the time between the waves could leave the game more frantic.

I think an additional solution would be to increase the number of objectives. These maps are great and their size is one of their strengths. Some maps that won't be reasonable but most can easily have room for 1-2 more objectives. I love push too. The part I love most is the pitched fights that happen when around the objectives. I think more of that if the map allows for it for be an improvement.

“Why cant I go into restricted areas in coop?”

So the bots can respawn and hopefully not spawn in view??

@Ziggylata There is no sense in having restricted area in bot mode

But I just explained why.

@skynet said in Playing ins:source since 2014 (4000 hours). Suggestion for sandstorm (TTK + AREA RESTRICTED + OTHERS):

TTK

At first I would like to talk about TTK which is the thing that most disappoints me in the game.

When I started playing ins: source I was very excited about the game, TTK was what differentiated the insurgency from any other game I had played. The low time to kill is what makes insurgency unique in my perception, few games have fast, hardcore and tactical style like ins: source.

I know that you NWI guys are trying to make a competitive game, but with that change the game loses its essence, I defend the idea that the TTK should be equal to ins: source or at least, lower than the current one.

  • Weapons 7.62 - 1 hit for unarmored, 2 hits for heavy armor

  • Weapons 5.56 - 1 hit for no armor, 2-3 hits for heavy armor

Currently the snipers bolt action are broken, 2 chest shots to kill is ridiculous

I agree with you 100%

last edited by Nick Kim

the ttk is already ridiculously low atm and armor is next to useless. if you want to kill enemies within 1-2 shots depending on their armor, just play high caliber weapons. i have no problem killing people in max. 2 shots with a FAL or AKM...or even m24 or mosin. that's the reality. TTK is low af.

@benz That means it's on the right direction

7.62 should be one hit against everything. 5.56 should be 1-2 hits against light and two against heavy. Then pistols/smgs should be 1 against no armor, 1-2 against light, and 2-3 against heavy.

last edited by cyoce

Everyones kind of projecting their thoughts as correct.

Im my opinion, TTK is fine for everything except bolt actions which should be 1 shot on everything except specifically the legs and even then thats a hard maybe.

To say 7.62 should oneshot, I am assuming you mean the x39 variant in AKs and stuff and ill quickly disagree there that they should absolutely not just oneshot, but they should definitely twoshot at most from a close distance. Something people dont consider as well is the range on these weapons and AKs have pretty low velosity and range and I feel this is an important factor. 5.56 shots from an M16 might not twoshot body armor every time but it will hit like hitscan across the map and make shots easy, as well as being effective up close in a small burst.

Im a big fan of what theyve got so far and I feel the complaints of lethality are forgetting that insurgency source had everyone running AP ammo without fail, 100% of the time. If Sandstorm had AP ammo im sure most of everyone would have the same TTK as source. I feel the removal of buying AP ammo is the best thing we could have gotten.

@geck0

@geck0 said in Playing ins:source since 2014 (4000 hours). Suggestion for sandstorm (TTK + AREA RESTRICTED + OTHERS):

@skynet said in Playing ins:source since 2014 (4000 hours). Suggestion for sandstorm (TTK + AREA RESTRICTED + OTHERS):

The gameplay in push and skirmish game modes is very slow compared to ins: source. I believe this is happening because the map is slightly larger and the objectives are scattered across the map. Changing the spawn distance to the objectives, especially in the push, and decreasing the time between the waves could leave the game more frantic.

I think an additional solution would be to increase the number of objectives. These maps are great and their size is one of their strengths. Some maps that won't be reasonable but most can easily have room for 1-2 more objectives. I love push too. The part I love most is the pitched fights that happen when around the objectives. I think more of that if the map allows for it for be an improvement.

I hope nwi develops smaller maps, as in ins: source. Large and open maps such as Crossing, hamper closed combat

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