Exploration - suggestion(s) for something new and interesting

According to devs world of Greedfall is inspired by Scotland, Iceland or Orkney and I hope they will use it for good effect (it would be fine to walk in some infamous moor etc). Few pictures:
http://cdn.cnn.com/cnnnext/dam/assets/170612142756-02-best-of-iceland-super-169.jpg
http://cdn.cnn.com/cnnnext/dam/assets/130917174157-wild-scotland-rannoch-moor-horizontal-large-gallery.jpg
http://www.wallpaperbetter.com/wallpaper/916/817/70/scotland-highland-valley-mountain-road-clouds-sky-sunset-1080P-wallpaper.jpg

Anyway I think that the location of big island gives opportunity for some fresh idea(s). So here is my suggestion:

1. Sea cliffs + Climbing + Caves on sea shores
Imagine cliffs on shores and below them, just between the sea and cliffs, is small zone of land that could be short or pretty long along the shore. Imagine there are places fo exploration like caves (including caves that are partially underwater) or small gorges or capes going into the sea. It would be nice to be able to explore these unique secluded places near the sea - maybe its not completely original, but I think its fresh experience and would use the location well and its doable.

See two pictures:
http://www.medievalists.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/old-man-hoy.jpeg
https://www.responsibletravel.com/imagesclient/rsz_tS_062341.jpg

To make it more interesting you can use one non-combat skill for that and that is climbing. You need to invest some point(s) in it and have rope. Climbing itself will be just simple short animation and then your hero will stand below. Some places will be more risky (need more point in climbing), others pretty easy. If you have companion that is good climber he/she could boost your skill.

Climbing was done in RPGs few times, but usually just to get higher. Now you could use it for exploration of unique sea shores.

2. Caves that are flooded in floodtide
Some caves on shores can be explorable only in certain time when its low tide. And you shouldnt waste too much time inside. Becase when its floodtide water will rise and flood whole cave (and could eventually kill you).

Its probably too tricky to do with your budget so I dont expect anything like that. But its not bad idea if you think about something fresh for exploration. It would be great if you could make something close to idea 1 + climbing skill, at least partially.

I'm all for new and interesting places to discover and explore, but slightly concerned about needing to unlock skills to do so. I've only played a few games from Focus (just started The Technomancer), but so far they've all had limits to how many skill points you can earn. I don't want to be locked out of too much stuff because I went down the wrong skill path.

@fortune86 said in Exploration - suggestion(s) for something new and interesting:

I'm all for new and interesting places to discover and explore, but slightly concerned about needing to unlock skills to do so. I've only played a few games from Focus (just started The Technomancer), but so far they've all had limits to how many skill points you can earn. I don't want to be locked out of too much stuff because I went down the wrong skill path.

There is no wrong skill path. It depends on your preference. If you choose most wanted skills first or most needed ones how could you say it was wrong? If you choose that climbing is useless its your choice. I dont see problem here.

And its non-conbat skill and these skills (perks) are cheap in Spiders games. In Technomancer there were several skills like that, each one had only 3 tiers.

I was under the impression that the climbing skill would give the player access to new areas, rather than the odd treasure chest or better crafting tiers. I haven't touched the stealth tree in Technomancer because it isn't really needed and there are other ways to fight. One of the things I like about the game is that there is always another option.

In the case where someone doesn't invest in the proposed climbing skills, how would they access these areas? Would you always have to go with +1 climbing partner?

@fortune86 said in Exploration - suggestion(s) for something new and interesting:

I haven't touched the stealth tree in Technomancer because it isn't really needed and there are other ways to fight.

I said nothing about stealth tree in Techno. I mentioned about non-combat skills like mechanics, science etc. Its not in stealth tree.

I was under the impression that the climbing skill would give the player access to new areas,

Yes.

In the case where someone doesn't invest in the proposed climbing skills, how would they access these areas?

If someone doesnt invest in climbing skill (perk) then he/she clearly doesnt want to explore these small areas. So no problem here. Its the same as ask "how could I use swords (proficiently) if I dont invest anything in sword/fencing skill tree?" It doesnt make sense. If player could just "bypass skills" in game mechanics then character development for the most part is useless. Player is responsible for his/her choice. So deal with it. If someone dont invest in climbing he/she is not interested so he/she shouldnt whine about it.

But as you suggested... there could be alternate solution for climbing if you have companion who is climbing expert. That could be ok.

I was using stealth as an example to show that even if you didn't invest in it you could still achieve the objective. I know you didn't refer to it. The difference between the skill trees in Technomancer is that you don't have to invest in any of them if you chose not to, but are still able to play the entirety of the game without missing out on anything. They simply make life easier rather than potentially locking you of sections of the game. If you are not able to charm or bribe your way around a problem, you can just fight.

Beating up a cliff face wouldn't really be an option though, which is why I figured having a non-skill tree option might save a lot of frustration.

Both sides of this have good points, but I'm kinda having the same worries about it being a point system.

Simple version: If climbing is a point system and the game ends up with a very limited amount of points, someone who WANTS to climb might not get it because other stuff is more essential at the moment. Those players would then not get access to certain parts of the game. If it wasn't a point system, problem solved.

I understand this struggle, because in a lot of rpgs there's this one trivial skill that I desperately want but can't get because I need to level up something else.

So yeah, in my opinion, I think climbing would be awesome, but would have issues as a skill tree.

@skylar-o-shea said in Exploration - suggestion(s) for something new and interesting:

Simple version: If climbing is a point system and the game ends up with a very limited amount of points, someone who WANTS to climb might not get it because other stuff is more essential at the moment. Those players would then not get access to certain parts of the game. If it wasn't a point system, problem solved.

How did you come to idea that there will be "very limited" amount of points? That is only your forced idea, nothing suggests that. Especially in modern ARPGs. Secondly non-combat skills has different pool of points than standard combat skills. So no, I dont think that this concern is legitimate.

I understand this struggle, because in a lot of rpgs there's this one trivial skill that I desperately want but can't get because I need to level up something else.

Really? Which RPGs and what trivial skill? "The need to level up something else" is very vague and unconvincing claim. You can say its "the need" while often there is no such thing - players usually just want something for some reason, usually combat skills, but they dont really need it. Especially in modern RPGs with some hidden form of level scalling etc. RPG is always about choices and priorities - if you are unable to give at least one point into skills such as climbing it means you are not interested in it. Dont blame the game for your own choices.

I just finished the Technomancer (great game btw) and there are three different trees that require points; combat skills, stats and field skills.

Combat skills seem to have unlimited points so you only really need to grind levels, but stats and field points are limited. If Greedfall is the same people will have to be careful about how they distribute them.

@farflame
I didn't "force" any idea, so you lied right there, my dude. I'm saying that COULD happen, not that it will. Simple misunderstanding.
Life's too short to get riled up over a video game, my friend.

I'm sure the developers will make it a fair system.

And one of the games where points was an issue was Divinity Original Sin where I didn't have enough points to get all unimportant skills that I wanted.

Don't accuse me of lying when you don't know me or the games I've played. Please and thank you!

@farflame

I feel bad for accusing you of lying when you might of honestly just misunderstood me, so I'm sorry for that.

I just feel utterly betrayed because I complimented you for thinking of climbing and providing good points then you kinda trashed me for having a different opinion. 😱

Let's agree to disagree and both wait eagerly for the game to arrive!

last edited by Skylar O'Shea

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