Feedback for devs after 20 hours of BETA

Hi everyone, I'm writing this lenghty post because I care about this game... I really want it to be as best as possible, but atm I have mixed feelings. I'll try to keep it as precise as possible for the devs:

General feelings:

  • lack of customisation makes the fleets feel general and 'not our own'.
  • larger map is a step in a good direction.
  • asteroid fields are too small and make no difference.
  • domination mode seems balanced, however people are afraid that it is the only MP mode out there (which will get boring quickly and might look like a money grab).
  • ship models look wonderful, you guys have really talented Zbrush sculptors.
  • people miss the shipyard and the ability to see their ships.
  • Huge numbers of turrets make torpedoes obsolte, unless in end game, where you won't be able to use all. This is coming from a torp player.
  • Turrets go through Attack Craft and torpedoes like paper.
  • Lances seem too weak allround
  • I love how fighters and attack craft work atm. Good job!
  • typos (for instance Raven Guard not Raven Guards etc

Fleetbuilding

  • Individual ships need a CAP. Nobody wants to play against 4 battleships. Spam brakes the multiplayer. Well balanced games try to avoid that (for instance Corvus Belli's - Infinity the Game).
  • some escorts don't seem to make any sense pointswise.
  • discrepancy in the number of ships between factions can be felt. Some factions are boring and if possible, GW should be pressed to add more like the Drukari battleship.

Skills

  • Different factions cannot share same skills, boring and lazy though understandable (balance)
  • some sub-factions have additional skills making them a prime choice
  • if possible add some skills/abilities to sub-factions, like some form of stealth for Night Lords or Baording actions causing Morale penalties, some demonic abilities to Word Bearers etc. Right now it's just a paintjob, with the lack of individual voice acting and abilities it feels lackluster.

Factions (baring in mind that ppl need to learn how to play a faction and how to play against one):
Oh well... let's begin with the most problematic races:

Necrons

  • Starpulse... is by far the most badly made ability in the game, along with the fleet ability to boost it's dmg. Necron players teleport, apply starpulse (for instance 4x 600dmg IIRC) - destroy everything and recall back half the map away. There is no counter, and spreading your forces helps, but they can simply repeat the attack. Every strategy should have counterplay - atm it's just pushing 2-3 buttons for a well-timed win while the opponent watches.
  • fleet is really boring, too few weapons and variety forces Necron players to do the above (usually with 4x Scythes).
  • thematic lack of shields is problematic - without the darn Starpulse, Necrons melt away.
  • balancing this fleet should be the main priority and the most difficult task
  • Current meta: 4x Scythe + extras for the above teleport action of death incarnate.

Adeptus Astartes - Space Marines

  • Weak fleet - expensive and surprisingly squishy when compared to BFG:A1.
  • Fleet focuses on boarding actions in which they don't excel, have limited number of attacks, and opponent's have a lot of countermeasures (abilities restocking troop count, a damn nasty scuttle mechanic)
  • Bombardment cannons are ok, however the fleet cannot seem to dash out any decent damage.
  • Currently playerrs run pase the enemy, apply boards, pray to the Emprah to survive and hope they can repeat. Even if a whole fleet attacks one enemy ship, it can either Scuttle and take it's revenge or simply restock the Troop count with their own boarding actions.
  • Turrets go through Attack Craft and torpedoes like paper. Doesn't help
  • Players should FEAR being close to SM. Atm they are happy to destroy one ship at a time, as the freightened Astartes players hopes he will survive the next breakthrough.

Drukarii

  • Currently a top tier army. Big range, near-constant stealth and huge speed. Surprisingly tough and able to ram 😱
  • Stealth mechanic is really cool and thematic, yet players dislike playing against them .
  • Some abilities attacking the opposing players Troop count are cool and thematic - maybe this should also be a focus?
  • Current meta is 4x Battleships on hit and run attacks melting everyone away. Again SPAM = bad gameplay. Add CAPs to ship.

Adeptus Mechanicus

  • 2 options: Nova Spam from Capital Ships or Light Cruiser spam.
  • great ship models, yet almost no difference from IN
  • we need more mechanicus-theme skills. Maybe some repair? Morale?

Eldar Corsairs/Asuryani

  • difficult to master, difficult to counter.
  • Asuryani already have a current meta of 4x Dragonships? - Extremely powerful and durable with near constant 80% dmg reduction?
  • Escorts used to be better choices for Eldar then they are currently.

Tyranids

  • Seem cool, people don't understand that they shouldn't ram with them, just use abilities, boarding actions etc
  • Stealth mechanic is nice
  • Very thematic abilities
  • Dunno if the morale penalty to enemies isn't too big
  • some players argue they are too squishy

Tau Merchants and Forgeworld

  • Gamebreaking bug with the multiplication of escorts in the merchant fleet
  • Hit like a brick, steer like a brick, takes the IQ of a brick to use them 😂
  • Great looking ships
  • Gameplay should be tweaked for a more interesting playstyle then just shooting from afar.

Chaos & Imperial Navy

  • most well balanced...
  • except for spam, like facting 4x IN battleships, or 8 same Chaos Cruisers

@Tindalos
You have advertised only one MP mode so far. People fear it is the only one. With the lack of progression and leaderboards providing no reward, the game might get boring very quickly, despite being a step in the right direction.
We need better communication - what can we expect more from the MP part of the game?
Maybe battle royale? 🤣 sry, couldn't resist

last edited by Lothair88

Yes agree with the majority of your good views. Concerning ship points, need adjusting to costly in some cases, or make battleship and cruisers have more longevity in battle? Points need re-balancing, and I agree they could make sub factions have different uniqueness for example white scars can go faster on engine burn or iron hands have more upgrades. Lore can play a huge part in this.

Battleship spam is generally awful except for some exceptions, lack of het makes it really easily to gain a positional advantage over them.

We don't need hard caps on battleships. They can be balanced organically instead of with a hard cap.

  1. Caps limit fleet customization and creativity, which is one of the really fun parts of the game.
  2. People should be allowed to play lower micro fleets if they want. Forcing a drukarhi player to use 7 ships instead of 4 with similar overall DPS/HP will just make people not want to play drukhari.
  3. Fighting against mostly-battleship fleets is just as fun as fighting against fleets with larger numbers of smaller ships. There's little fundamental change in the tactics of playing against, say, BC drukari vs BB drukhari
  4. Mostly BB fleets give up a lot of mobility and cap control. For example, a BB + escorts IN fleet is very vulnerable to being outcapped, forced to split up, and then picked apart. Or hit by bombs/novas or ships in their rear arcs. The four BB drukhari fleet can't bring any escorts, which is a nice bit of micro reduction for the drukhari player, but leaves them very vulnerable to being outcapped by silent running enemy escorts. I suspect 3 BB + 1 CR or GC + 2 escorts is a stronger fleet, just less fun to play.

Other Stuff

  • Agreed, we need more nebula/asteroids
  • Having different modes will cause huge balance issues. For example, drukhari rely on splitting up the enemy fleet a bit before they engage. If there was a "cruiser clash" mode, drukhari would lose every match to heavy ships that just sat in a nebula, and would need to be buffed. Which would lead to them being overwhelmingly OP in cap points mode. You probably remember this from BFG1, where eldar automatically won data missions against orks and orks automatically won station defense vs eldar.
  • Agreed, turrets are too strong, brace should lose the +100% or turrets should overall be nerfed
  • Agreed, Necron starpulse needs to do significantly less damage. Necrons need HP, regen rate, and maybe DPS buffs to compensate.
  • Agreed, SM are absolute garbage and need huge buffs. Scuttle needs a 10 second spool up or to do way less damage. Hulking a ship should probably apply a permanent penalty, like -10% to everything, that triggers EVERY time a ship gets hulked and stacks. So you can't just recrew a ship 5 times and it's fine.
  • Admech also have the option to bring a bunch of cruisers, like Lunars, for maximum novas. BBs are not the only way to play them. They're in a good place overall.
  • Drukhari are good but they really suffer from poke damage when revealed due to the lack of shields and armor. They eat excessively heavy fleets alive or players who are careless with their escorts, but a good player can beat them with IN or something similar. Might be worth removing the 4.5k admiral upgrade because 18k stealth is pretty cancerous, but they don't need major nerfs. People need to play better / bring more escorts.
  • Asuryani meta is the torpedo macro cruisers, orbiting at 13.5k with the 270 arc stance and the +4.5k range upgrade on. It's maybe the best fleet in the game right now, high damage, very tanky, very hard to counter. Might be worth changing 270 arc to 180 arc to make the kiting less oppressive and distinguish them from corsairs.
  • Corsairs just need more damage, especially on pulsars. Right now they are strictly worse than craftworld in every category except access to the voidstalker BB, and voidstalkers are just not as good as macro cruiser asuryani in 90% of circumstances.
last edited by Jamodon

Necrons are in a hilarious situation that I have only ever seen in dota in that they are disgustingly overpowered when one ability is used for something it was not intended for and absolutely useless when they don’t do that. I’m kind of old fashioned in that this caused me a great deal of consternation after seeing it (I’m kind of dumb and don’t figure out such meta things until shown) and thus swore not to use it. It’s...
Not gone well, shall we say.
Anyways as I’ve been saying since August THEY NEED MORE SHIPS/GUNS. A carrier alone would be great but lorewise Necrons have a ton of weapons systems like death rays and heat weapons and the hearts of dead stars as torpedoes. New guns aren’t exactly something hard to come up with, and I remain salty the Necrons (the most hyped faction in the trailers) got ONE new ship to the druhkari’s SEVENTEEN. Addressing thus would certainly help the poor guys out. Don’t make us have Trazyn start stealing other factions ships, you know we would do it!

last edited by Nemesor Xanxas
  1. I agree with Necrons and Astartes needing some love. Even if they are just tougher so they can actually endure a close up beat down.

  2. Looking forward to seeing more environmental effects! In my opinion no map should ever be without gas clouds or asteroid fields.

  3. (out there) Perhaps making CP do something? Perhaps have the points be represented by little satellites or space stations that can defend themselves or provide buffs to controlling ships nearby? I feel like there is some room for a more engaging mechanic.

Macht finding and creating in 1vs1 is bugged.
Crashes with error message and frossen screen, with achivment picture from me and the enemy.

Necron:
Capital Perk should be more defensiv not like Chains e.g. offensiv.
Star Impulse should not make dmg. It Should be given necron area instand healing. Atm Necron playing ist blink and bomb.
Passive Regeneration, dont work at necron Ships. Only Skarabäen aktiv Perk and generall Perk stay into a gas cloud.
Kopesh has 1200HP instad of 800 and only 1 has 13500 detection range.
Hunter Ships are too weak für Necrons.
Moral is not fine for necrons, should be phase out at 60% of ships destrout at point of cost.

@jamodon the craftworld eldar damage output is ridiculous high, 28 macro dps for 213 points + 8 torps. compared to the dark eldar cruiser you pay 19 points more and get a holofield, 2dps and 2 torps more at a tradeoff of 40 speed and worse boarding. they are priced as if they are fragile, which they are not. furthermore, I think giving them wide firing arcs is extremely bad and it totally destroys eldar gameplay.

last edited by Fosil

yeah cw heavily over perform right now.

Additional thoughts after some more time:

Escorts

  • Escort squadrons don't seem to put out any meaningful DPS. I don't know what changed, but in BFG:A1 I regularly fielded several Aconites, Swords, Idolators and they did their job. In this game (maybe range/accuracy?) they seem to shoot pebbles at starships 😉
  • Some escort points cost don't seem to make any sense, nor have any meaningful role.
  • Scouting role is finally a thing 🙂 GJ Tindalos.

Carriers, attack craft and torps

  • Gameplay with them is a blast - with te ability to scout with fighters and dmg opposing turrets the carrier-game has become a much better experience.
  • The number of uses to 3 is the best gameplay decision from BFG:A1=>BFG:A2! People simply need to learn to use them differently then before and they become a powerful weapon.
  • Torpedoes on the other hand seem extremely squishy to take out. While turrets serve a good role vs attack craft, I think torps should be more difficult to take out, otherwise they don't seem to be viable.

Ps. I still think that SPAM is killing the META and any sort of balance. Especially the number of BS should be capped like escorts, for instance to 2, maybe 3 for Orks or Tyr.

last edited by Lothair88

nearly all BS-heavy lists are trash.

@fosil

Boring, not-true to the lore and mostly counterable due to domination mode. However, the problem is with multiple Drukhari/Asuryani BS and some 4x Imperial ones.

I know this is GW and GW always sucked at balance to sell more stuff, but a force organisation chart or anything that limits spam is necessary in any MP strategy game.

DE BBs are OP so not very good for a general comment, 3 phoenix is a mid tier way to run CW who also over perform with runic targeting giving them 270 degree arc of fire. What 4 IN battleships are you running into? Having no ships with HET is an awful idea.