Balance suggestions from top 20 player without focusing on any 1 faction

Balancing this game cannot be easy with 12 factions, each with their own lore and strengths and weaknesses but after getting 3 different factions (Tau protector, Orks and Astartes) to top 20 and 50 I saw several identical patterns even with widely different factions.

  1. Some ship classes are outright worse
    Almost every factions' light cruisers and battleships are simply not worth it.

For the price of 1 battleship i can bring 2-3 cruisers on average. Having twice or three times as many ships is powerful enough even if the rest of the stats match but once you add speed, guns, boarding, shields and hull, there is not logical reason to ever bring a battleship(orks, DE and nids are notable exceptions to the rule).

Astartes are the best example: for the price of 1 batlebarge i can bring 3 strike cruisers. Now lets to do some quick math:
Shields 200x3 vs 600=>equal
Hull 1200x3 vs 2400=>1200 hull advantage cruisers
Boarding 8-12 x3 vs 12-18=> double boarding advantage cruisers, not even accounting for the honor of the chapter ability
Speed 200x3 vs 160=> Not only 1 battlebarge can be in 1 place at a time but it will get there much slower
Weapons are a bit variable but in general battleships' only advantage is the range of their guns. 3 cruisers at closer range will inflict far more damage

So what is the solution? in this case, fairly simple: lower battleship costs and maybe give them some kind of aura ability appropriate for the faction. Lets say for imperial navy for the next 30 seconds take no morale damage. Or for the tau for the next 30 seconds rail guns reload faster. Maybe, make it so that the battleships' stance applies to all allied ships within the identification range, so we could stack buffs. Otherwise, i have no reason to bring a battleship into the fight.

Light cruisers, the story is similar. I can bring 3 destroyers for the price of 1 LC and get the same hull, shields but more utility and firepower. Lower LC price a bit and give LCs the same identification ability that escorts have. Because right now I see no reason to bring even 1 light cruiser into the mix (Tau is the only exception because Tau LC give me escorts)

  1. Boarding is too powerful

Boarding right now can disable a ship in 3 different ways:
1 Make it less effective and eventually turn it into a hulk as the troop count goes to 0
2 Disable weapons and subsections.
3 Inflicts morale damage thus making the ship mutiny

I think there is a reason why the top winning factions are Tyranids and Orks. These factions are really good at boarding. I do not think these factions are too strong, they just benefit from boarding a bit too much. In fact, I got to top 10 the first time as astartes by abusing their boarding capabilities. So what can be done?

Because right now an IN cruiser can be taken out by 3-4 boarding actions from a faction with good troop efficiency. In other words, in a fight between 6 IN cruisers and lets say 10 ork cruisers. The moment the two fleets get into fighting range. The imperial navy player will lose at least 2 ships to boarding. At that point mopping up the rest of the fleet is easy. Dont get me even started on how much damage the tyranids can do.

I think all factions' troop counts need to go up as a start. Maybe add an extra step of crew levels before a ship is turned into a hulk.
Reduce the crit chance and morale damage from boarding as well. Boarding already inflicts guaranteed crits and debuffs as it brings the troop count levels lower, no need for that much extra damage. Maybe, make it so that brace for impact lowers boarding damage instead of removing morale damage from ramming to reward players for switching stances from lock on during a long range engagement to brace at closer ranges.

  1. Criticals are too plentiful

I touched upon this in the melee section a bit but in general critical hits are inflicted way too often. My tau fleet taught me this very clearly. As soon as the shields drop the enemy ships start losing subsections, get fires, lose weapons and direct damage from my weapons almost becomes meaningless. Also, the way critical hits are calculated favors the fleets and factions that have many small weapons rather than a few large ones.

The solution here is also pretty simple. Lower the crit chance boost from lock on to 50% rather than 100%. And make it so that weapons that hit harder are the ones that are more likely to inflict critical damage. Otherwise, factions like orks and tau and eldar will always have an advantage.

Thank you for reading and making this game.

Orks and nids are most certainly too powerful lmao. Lock on is bugged, it doesn't actually increase crit chance right now. I don't know if the additional acc comes into effect but the extra range does.

last edited by BrohanBroski

Boarding deals too much troops lost and too fast. Ships are kilometers longs and with thousands crews but 3 boarding parties from SM CR = hulk. All boardings should deals 50% less troop damages as now but shouldn t have the ammo cap.

Also Brace + SM is problematic because standar guns and even lances deals no more damages to them

@giant-burger Just here to say I agree with your review 100%. Spot on analysis.

Are we just going to ignore how Necron lose to ork in long range shoot out...

The only point I would disagree on is the light cruisers and the battleships.

You can get more total health on massed lighter ships, but battleships give single-target persistence. if you make them cheaper we'll be back to the battleship mass fleets again, the whole point of having things like cruisers is greater capability distributed across multiple hulls.

Light cruisers can offer utility that escorts can't- carrier wings, boarding actions, and greater resistance to ramming.

Everything else I agree with.

BBs are like an all in, you put a lot of HP/damages into 1 ship that have to carry the game. This strategy is not good today because it will be hulked/crit too death/moral mutiny easily

@themadtypist said in Balance suggestions from top 20 player without focusing on any 1 faction:

The only point I would disagree on is the light cruisers and the battleships.

You can get more total health on massed lighter ships, but battleships give single-target persistence. if you make them cheaper we'll be back to the battleship mass fleets again, the whole point of having things like cruisers is greater capability distributed across multiple hulls.

Light cruisers can offer utility that escorts can't- carrier wings, boarding actions, and greater resistance to ramming.

Everything else I agree with.

Everything you mentioned I took into account and those two classes still come too expensive.

Light cruisers' boarding utlity is very limited and escorts' ability to mark and spot stealthed ships far surpasses it. In other words, LCs job can be done better by a Cruiser, whereas escorts job cannot be done by anyone else.

Battleships are simply too vulnerable to crits and boarding. Almost every match ends with a battleship that still has plenty of health but useless because it is too slow, too crippled or too scared and running away.

One of the most valuable feedback on the forum.

Balancing the game by increasing or reducing the ships point cost is the easiest way, but the suggestions made here by Giant Burger are by far more interesting.

Because we are supposed to play BFG, big guns should count and approaching them for boarding should be a riskier manœuvre. One of the thing that makes BFG so fun is that you feel like you are playing a naval battle of the 18th century but in space, exchanging powerful broadside fires and executing subtiles manœuvre.

last edited by Hadral

imo the most elegant solution to boarding is to reduce boarding strength by x for every amount of intact turrets y (like for example one less boarding strength for 3 intact turrets). lightning strikes would stay the same with maybe some minor adjustments. that would mean that you want to board downwards regarding ship classes, it would make huge points sinks BB quite resilient against boarding attacks from smaller ships and it would give nids a small exploitable weakness in the boarding gameplay.

regarding LCs: there are some underpriced LCs in the roster of a few fleets and the other major point for LCs are fast silent running point cap builds.

last edited by Fosil

@fosil that would make necrons really strong against boarding, maybe to much but is an interesting idea. i say necrons because you cant destroy their turrets.

@imptastic the faction with high priced ships, low troops per point cost and no shields (lightning strike weakness) could use some help. 😉

You're certainly not wrong about boarding and morale and how the increased surviveability and point cost of ships overall has made these overpowering in comparison to actually damaging the enemy fleet conventionally. Can't agree with you about LCs though. Mass stealth daunt is the only truly competitive IN setup right now and the only way I reliably beat top 10 orks and nids as IN.

last edited by BrohanBroski