Gang member class System. Thoughts?

Hey Gangers
What are peoples thoughts on the gang member class system? (links below)
List of classes as well as leader:

Deadeye: Snipers
Brawler: Melee, blunt force
Heavy: Heavy hitter, powerful weapons
Saboteur: Setting traps

The difference can be seen in the screenshots of each gang

http://www.necromunda-underhivewars.com/en/media
With a leader in the middle .

It looks interesting as a frame to build on, and nice to see that it isn't a straight to pc version of N17 tabletop.
i hope we can include some juves as pre class specified gangers

there is more in these older articles (from june and september last year)
https://www.gamersdecide.com/pc-game-news/necromunda-underhive-wars-release-date-gameplay-trailers-story-news
https://rpgamer.com/2018/06/necromunda-underhive-wars-e3-impression/
https://variety.com/2018/gaming/features/necromunda-underhive-wars-interview-1202847934/

seems the initiative ladder is coming over from Mordheim city of the damned too. it seems alot of effort is being put into speeding gameplay up.

First of all, the initiative ladder is something i had kind of a gripe with, but looking back i think it was a quite decent system. Not perfect, but still good enough. The thing i'm wondering is: Will initiative be determined by agility? or by other stat (like awareness)? Mainly because in current Necromunda Initiative is like agility, being required for climb or jump tests as well as for evading special attacks, like grapples and such.

Second, i really want that they pute Juves into the game, but with a small difference. Be it as they can be recruited for cheaper than a Ganger, but they are comparatively worse than a ganger (low weapon skill/ballistic skill, poor leadership, etc), but if they get rank 1, they become a ganger instantly with their stats are slightly better than a fresh ganger. That would be a nice way of implementing Juves making you want to get a few measuring the cons and pros.

The classes look quite nice, and i want to know if aside from weapon restriction, they will all share the same skills or have unique skills per class (and also per house). I'm very interested in the Saboteur and the trap mechanic. I already can see the Cawdor Gangers releasing hordes of bomb rats onto the battlefield, but i wonder if all houses will have different types of traps or not (like Escher having poison traps, orlock having blasting traps, etc...). Still, rooting for a bit of gameplay to see a bit of the action, but i can picture more or less how they go.

@glarghface said in Gang member class System. Thoughts?:

"Second, i really want that they pute Juves into the game, but with a small difference. Be it as they can be recruited for cheaper than a Ganger, but they are comparatively worse than a ganger (low weapon skill/ballistic skill, poor leadership, etc), but if they get rank 1, they become a ganger instantly with their stats are slightly better than a fresh ganger. That would be a nice way of implementing Juves making you want to get a few measuring the cons and pros."

This is exactly how I want Juves to work.

last edited by SpikeC91

I'd really like to see how Saboteurs will work out.
I'm kinda worried that due to the fact that they might be reliant on the enemy falling into their traps that they will be "underpowered" compared to the other classes.

Yes, I too think its silly that we haven't even seen all the confirmed classes and I'm all "uh dur trap class might not be strong uh dur".

Does anyone else share this worry? I love traps, its just I think in this kind of game that they are going to end up being the hardest class to use.

I also have a super off topic question.
Yall know how space marines and such have access to power armor?
Is there any form of power armor (at all) available in necromunda?
Could kinds of Daemons make an appearance too? (in any way, shape, or form)

On the topic of traps, i also want to see how they will work and how "strong" they will be in terms of damage and functionality. Traps in Mordheim were quite nice (white powder trap the best imo), but i hope we are given different kinds of traps depending on the house we play to mix it up a little bit. For example, in the lore Cawdor gangers sometimes carry trained rats riddled with bombs that they let out in the battlefield. I can kinda see the homing bomb mechanic working with the same mechanic it has in tabletop, but i wonder if we will only be limited to explosive traps or anything else.

I also wonder how they will do in open combat.

And on the other questions, here are the answers:
Space marines have access to power armor because it's given to them. The chapter provides for weapons and armor for their battle brothers. And the chapter is given weapons and armor by the Imperium at large, who manufactures it in many worlds all over the galaxy.

Gangers have no access to power armor. The closest you can get is the combat armor from the Arbites and the special suits of the Spyrers. Gangers usually carry makeshift armor and the closest you can get to armor is Mesh armor.

Chaos Daemons could appear if we get chaos cults around, but i doubt it. But you musn't rule out the feisty beasts that are in the underhive, such as giant rats, spiders and other nasty mutant creatures.

@Glarghface
initiative ladder in mordheim had the potential for the savviest of players activate all their units at a similar time and sort of sweep through and dominate combats but i never saw anyone come close to that level of mastery. unsure what stat lines are being thought about.

secondly i like juves but haven't seen a mention yet, leader while still having a role, seems to be the only non class position (hey! Rogue Factor. juves?) as well spikec91 i always found youngbloods and juves funny in that they could launch across the battlefield capture objectives and perform feats, so eager to please but couldn't fight their way out of a wet paper bag until later levels . im happy with what MCOTD did with them.

the dead eye class is the only one able to zip line or grapnel up to higher platforms. this was mentioned in some of the articles about E3. other classes i dunno.
@GingerRoeBro my speculation about sabateurs may be the one with grenades or better at opening doors blocking access to lifts etc.

Well, i'm curious if the statlines will keep being like in Mordheim, which isn't bad since we are used to them, or they will have any change. In tabletop, for example, there are 2 stats to account for: cool and leadership. While leadership is for terror, fear and all alone tests, cool is in order to perform actions in the battlefield successfully (such as using poison on a weapon, healing a comrade etc...). I wonder if they will be kept separately or they will both be compounded in Leadership.

I also kinda want to see how Leaders and Champions go in the game, because in Tabletop Necromunda champions and leaders had access to special weapons only they could wield (such as combi weapons or the more brutal ones like plasma pistols and power hammers). Now that you say it, are these classes only for run of the mill gangers or they apply as well to Champions and Leaders?

Also, when it comes to juves they can also be adressed in the same way youngbloods were in Mordheim, but i think that would be a bit too simple. I think it would be more interesting in one of two ways: either starting very weak and having higher stat growth or more skill point gain than gangers or the way i previously stated (they start very weak but once they get 1 level they become a level 0 ganger with better stats than a hired level 0 ganger).

@Glarghface
about champs and juves, im not holding my breath.
read the articles i linked in OP, tie them to the screenshots that have been released. 8 months ago it was just 5 different classes being toted.
Leader
Saboteur
Deadeye
Heavy
Brawler
i'm certain a leader will have access to a mix of most weapons, equipment and some entry skills
no mention of either champ or juve.

i'm curious if you can take more than 1 of each class and what is maximum sizes gang. i like the idea of a pair of deadeyes one long range sniper, other medium range, high volume shooting.

stat lines im unsure about and i don't care too much atm.

@gingerroebro
Power Armor would be all but restricted to Arbites and Spyerers. Power Armor is an Adeptus Mechanicus thing as it's a technology too important to leave to common citizens of the Imperium. Necromunda wouldn't have Power Armor facilities most likely due to them being a Hive World rather than a Forge World. Van Saar could kinda justify Power Armor because as of the new edition of Necromunda they have a malfunctional STC, so they have the technology. The problem would be that is Tech Heresy and would probably see their whole House wiped out by the Inquisition or something due to Power Armor being too important. I've read most of the original Necrumunda novels and they didn't have an example of any gangers with access to it, so I'd say pretty much no.

If anything it would be an Ultra Rare item in the Black Item. Something that would have to be smuggled in off world, and given the strict control of intergalactic shipping and the size of Power Armor it would be all but impossible to attain by anyone but the biggest and most powerful gang leaders.

So in short, Power Armor doesn't make a whole lot of sense unless Arbites are a thing. If Arbites and Spyrers get added, then they'd have access. As far as Gangers at that point it would make sense to be able to Loot the corpses of Arbites and Spyrers to get their armor. That was something that did happen in the Kal Jerico novel, where after they killed a Spyrer a Ganger took their gear for themselves. Without these groups then really I think that it would only make sense for high level campaign bosses to have them. It would be justifiable for some powerful enemy to have access to it. Having every gang inevitably getting access to Power Armor at some point wouldn't be very lore appropriate.

Which makes me think about the Saboteur class. Since they are the more tech focused class engineering and looting skills could be an interesting choice. Support characters do tend to at least feel underpowered, but if they get gear and loot bonuses then it could even things out more, making them more useful in the post-game and campaign.

last edited by DeTortor

@DeTortor yes i've been thinking about the saboteur role too. i was thinking that sabotaging someones operation, equipment or keeping it running thru a fire fight is going to really affect territory income, territory ownership, loot, etc.

it would be a better way to differentiate between classes better than, saboteurs =traps grenades, dead eye = long range weapons, brawler = melee heavy =heavy weapons

i'm sure for those who know Deep Rock Galactic and the fact it has a steam rating of over90% is the strong focus on the different roles of each class, while each is operated by a different player they all have their job to do, and being what seems to be a support role is no less important.

If the saboteur ends up being an explosives expert that will be interesting for 2 reasons. It will mean that maybe explosives (grenades, shaped charges...) will count as weapons and not consumable items like the Oil bombs in Mordheim. And also it might mean we will see mission objectives, such as "destroy a water depo" or "Blast a hole into a settlement wall".

Also, when it comes to classes will the deadeye be capable of using short range weapons like pistols and shotguns? Or they will be limited to long range only like LasGuns, Rad weapons and Needle rifles? And what heavy weapons will we have available? Old Necromunda had plenty of heavy weapons to choose (Las cannon, Heavy Bolter, Plasma Cannon...) but so far in the rulebook i've seen Heavy Stubbers and Twin linked Las Carbines.

Thank you all for the help in my questions on power armor being in necromunda (lore/books/or game)
And for the help in whether daemons are possible too, I greatly appreciate it.

I definitely hope it is not possible to have a whole squad in power armor, Especially since I fear it would make it to where the "go to" strategy is get power armor and win.

If it is included I do truly hope its extremely rare.
When it comes to Saboteur's I am really intrigued. Especially since my main plan I'd end up starting with in this, is mostly close combat to medium based. Like submachine gun, pistols, melee, and shotgun type weapons.

I am also curious if we will be able to capture enemy gangers on this.

When it comes to power armor, i think you will definetly not be able to have access to it unless your gang packs enough heat to take down a spyrer or an Adeptus Arbites, and that is if they are a thing in the game. But what i hope is that we get many different variants of armor with a lot of different effects, like the nanoscale armor (armor that has less effect with every hit taken) or Camaleonine (doesn't grant armor but makes you harder to be hit with ranged attacks) rather than just having no armor, light and heavy armor.

And that doesn't mean your gang cannot have access to some truly monster weapons like in Old Necromunda like Heavy Bolters and Plasma cannons. Sure, only the most powerful and rich gangs could affort to have one, but it was still one.

Also, capturing gangers was and is still a thing in tabletop and you could either demand ransom for the ganger, sell them into slavery or put them to work in your turf (like in a mine or a toxic waste dump).

Oh thank goodness! I really love variety and would love it even more if there were more to look forward to then light, medium, and heavy armor. I really am curious as to what kind of armors are possible and have found my new #1 question for the devs. Will there be kill animations of any sort? I'm meaning similar to 40k dawn of war. Like a synchronized kill. I love these so much in games and in an environment as brutal as necromunda it doesn't seem out of place.

I'm very interested in some of the armor's you listed. I already knew capturing gangers was a thing, but I was wondering how it would be implemented. I could definitely see diplomacy or hostage/prisoner rescue being a thing if they wanted to.

Now one thing I am not certain if it was an actual thing or not and am having a hard time finding is if you have lets say, a juve that gets a leg blown off, would you beable to replace that leg in any form or would he be forced to keep it?
I'm a huge fan of xcom series and can't wait to see how it plays out 🙂

Just for clarity, I am very new to necromunda but I am very familiar with warhammer fantasy and loved 40k (dawn of war 40k won me over on that) , I do try to look things up before I ask, so I don't end up asking for something like estalian angels lol. So, if I do ask something outlandish please correct it.

I also want more armors than Light, medium and heavy. In old necromunda there were several types of armor or combat suits (Mesh armor, carapace armor, flak armor, camaleonine...) but in current edition necromunda Flak armor is kinda the "normal" armor even if in old edition it would be heavy armor, but in the new edition you also have the reinforced underplate, which grants a bit of extra armor. I hope we get a lot of variety when it comes to armor instead of just 3 types, making you able to customize even more your gang. And when it comes to sync kills, that's up to the devs, but it would be a nice touch.

When it comes to capturing gangers i wonder if it will be implemented and how will it be. I can definetly see the "you take the stuff this guy had" thing and also the chance that he has a subdermal blade and he escapes, but this is a question for another time.

As for permanent injuries, of course you can replace missing limbs. In Necromunda you have bionics in order to "salvage" a ganger with a missing arm or leg, since basic bionics are not as good as an arm or a leg. Eventually you can buy advanced bionics which are better, but that's a matter of money. Also i want them to expand on the permanent injury system, implementing things like old wound (random chance a ganger cannot fight), fearsome scars (ganger inflics fear) or valiant scars (+1 leadership).

Also, if you have any questions just ask away. We may be a bunch of nerds (at least i am) but we don't eat people. Well, most of the time.

@glarghface The novel Fleshworks was pretty much entirely about hunting down a ganger to harvest his bionic limbs. This actually highlights one of the possible utilities of Saboteurs. In the novel the Van Saar had booby trapped their House's bionics so when a rival House tried to analyze their technology it exploded.

Therefore a pretty lore friendly way to have a pretty good idea that the enemy will actually walk to your trap is if you rig your own bionic limbs to explode. Gamewise if your ganger's dead and they're chopping his robot arm off to take home it'd open quite a few game possibilities. A bionic limb could function like a mine that activates on Ganger death, which could work by proximity, rigged to blow when they try to rip it off, or have your Gang Leader hold a detonator.

If rival gangs are persistent and hold territory then there can even be Campaign options. Let the enemy take your man's bionics home then blow it up there. Pretty sure you'd want a Sabatuer to disarm it in that case.

Or imagine if you could do some sort of Side Ops where you trick the enemy into buying a rigged bionic limb from your Gang. Personally I think it'd be pretty funny to win a Shootout by blowing off your challengers arm with the push of a button. But of course I'm a Tzeentch Sorcerer jovial Inquisitor.

last edited by DeTortor

@glarghface

Awww yes, thank you very much and everyone else too for the help! 🙂

The last and only question I have left which is what I would consider on topic for the thread honestly since it might represent a possible class is......

http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2018/08/necromunda-inside-gang-war-4-bionics-cyborgs-psykers-more.html

I've been trying to understand whether or not psychers are a possible thing within necromunda.
I knew they were within chaos cults, and the genestealers but I'm meaning in general.
Like do any other houses have access to them.
I was reading this trying to find out, but I can't tell if this stuff is actually new, fan made, or if its been there and I'm late to the party lol.

So, since I now realize that bionics are a thing. What about some of this other stuff in the link?
To sum the things in it up,
Van Saar Aracharid
Goliath ‘Zerker
Escher Chimera
Cawdor Stig Shambler

Are these an equivalent to impressives from mordheim?

last edited by GingerRoeBro

Oh yes... I have that gang war supplement and i made my own Cawdor gang. This one included a lot of new stuff and i liked the direction the game was taking with mercenaries, psykers and new gang units.

Psykers are definetly a possibility in Necromunda. In the lore they establish that there are 2 types of psykers: sanctioned (AKA trained) and unsanctioned. The main difference between both is that santioned psykers can reroll failed willpower tests, meaning that if you fail to use a warp power, you can try again and succeed. As well, in the game it stablishes that if you take down an unsactioned psyker, your gang recieves 5 credits for it (since unsanctioned psykers are pretty much outlaws). I still want to see how psychic powers are dealt with, but you can definetly get psykers into your gang, no matter which house you are.

Those other things are special gang units. Like you side, they are the equivalent of impressives in Mordheim: extremely tough and lethal, but also costly and you cannot have more than a certain amount depeding on your gang's reputation. Aside from the amazing statlines of these guys, they have a lot of special weapons and rules that makes them amazing. For example, the Escher Khimerix has scaled skin +4 (meaning it has a 4+ armor save) and regeneration, as well as poison attacks and poison breath attacks. The Van Saar arachnid rig suit has a climbing special rule that allows it to climb on any surface as well as 4 melee attacks per turn (unless you decide to turn 2 of those into ranged attacks by adding ranged weapons) and twin linked las carbines. Also, you forgot the Orlock mining servitor, which is a heavy weapons platform that can shoot and move in the same turn and has a +1 bonus to ammo rolls, meaning that this guy is truly damn dangerous.

My all time fav is the Stig Shamber, because it is a heavy weapons platform that also is very dangerous in melee. And thanks to his special rule, it can re roll failed leadership tests. Overall, all these units mean a lot of business and i want to see how they are implemented. Mainly because of their special rules (being regeneration the most tricky).

last edited by Glarghface

@glarghface Nice! Now you got me to wanting the stig shambler and to seeing some psykers lol.
Dang it sounds like the special gang units are definitely forces to be reckon with.
I found something that has me literally just going off the rails happy if this is actually official.
http://files.sigil.biz/data/o_deviant_scum.pdf
Cause that means!
Daemons and rules for em, Chaos space marine! Eldar! Orks! Beastmen!

Ooooooh the possibilities!

Ahhhh! I want info game devs! Its already March! 😢

I'm glad i got you interested on those, but first we should know how they will adress them in game. I want to know if psychic powers will be treated like magic was in Mordheim (first you roll for spell success and then if there is an after effect) and what the consequences of using the powers of the warp will be, because the worst that could happen in the Tabletop is that your psyker ends up posessed by a chaos daemon or exploding in a massive warp energy backlash.

Those special units are truly very dangeous, but they all have their weaknesses or else they would be way too strong. For example, the Stig Shambler despite being very tough, having more mobility than anyone (movement speed of 7, compared to the average of 6 and the Goliaths with 5) and having 2 weapons (the melee one with 3 attacks), it has poor ballistic skill and weapon skill. Pretty much, you will be lucky if you land an attack. But if you land it, it will hurt. Another example is the Khimerix, which despite having very high initiative, decent toughness, strength and also has regeneration, it's weak to fire (cancels regeneration) and also has poor leadership, meaning that it will run away like a scared puppy if you have 3 gangers surrounding it.

Well, those rules are from older Necromunda, but when it comes to it lorewise, they are possible (except chaos space marines and chaos daemons, or else the inquisition would be too interested in going down there). The scavvies are something many people want back in Necromunda, because in old necromunda they were quite damn strong if you played them right. If you won't know what a scavvie is, it's a heavily and grisly mutated person that has been sent to live in the far and dark corners of the underhive. Even tho in the Underhive mutation is tolerated within acceptable bounds, mutants are usually more despised than in the hive proper, and therefore most settlements openly reject them or outright kill mutants. There are other denizens of the Underhive that are worth mentioning: the Ratskins. These are considered the "original" inhabitants of the underhive and they know it like the back of their hand.

When it comes to possibilities, i really want Ork corsairs venturing in the underhive to sack and kill. Or Dark Eldar raiders taking down gangs to engross the amount of slaves they take. Possibilities are abound and we all have our favourites. But for now, let's wait until we get a little morsel from the devs. I bet they have something juicy for us, but good things always deserve the wait.