A full review of Admec, and what we can do with them.

Hello everyone. I am currently the # 6 Admec player on the ladder and wanted to share with you my thoughts and ideas about Admec and what I would do to rework them a bit. I apologize in advance for the giant wall of text but I do appreciate anyone who’s willing to read through this.

Pros:
Exceptional accuracy trait: all of your macro and plasma macros are far more accurate than other race’s weapons. With lock on, you still have a 45% accuracy rate at +23K range.

Strong lances: Admec lances are 50% stronger than imperial versions.

Improved subsystem repair: Along with the standard repair function, it will regenerate half of your combustion gauge and 30% of your shields

Nova cannons: Long range artillery that can be used to cause hull damage, morale damage, and even stasis fields. You must master this ability as this is mandatory on anything cruiser and bigger.

Multiple useful admiral abilities.

You will win nearly any long range shoot-out.

Cons:
Low moral: the -25 bravery modifier means that you will route quicker than most other fleets. Maybe the flesh isn’t so weak if machines get so scared.

Low troop values: For some reason, cybernetically enhanced killer robots are really really bad at close combat or shooting things up close in a confined hallway. You can’t board for shit and you drop super quick when boarded by anybody. Tau is a boarding threat to you.

Lower rotational speed: you will feel sluggish compared to most fleets

Nova cannons: They are your biggest liability as they have a minimum range of 2500 units and you have no choice but to take them. They are almost useless as a single weapon and must be used to volleys to be effective.

Very little viable fleet customization: No battle cruiser, grand cruisers to select from.

Mostly garbage fleet upgrades.

The counter to your fleet is “run at you”. You are not a competitive fleet unfortunately as you are a one-trick pony forced to rely on your Nova Cannon.

Playstyle: Admec’s goal in every match up is to play a long range sniping match using their superior accuracy on macros and powerful lances. Nova Cannons provide constant artillery support and stasis fields to protect your fleet. You should never clump your fleet as once its cornered you cannot use your Novas. Spreading your fleet into 2-3 groups makes it so you can cover each other with your Nova cannons as you retreat.

As seen above, Nova Cannons are your best friend and worst enemy. Novas are not your main damage source. They are supplementary weapons that you must make use of but your broadsides will be doing most of the heavy lifting. The use of these Novas is what separates a winning and losing player Admec fleet so they deserve their own section:

6K-25K range, 2K AoE, 200-400 damage, 100 morale damage, tooltip says ignores armor but I can’t trust tooltips in this game so I’m not sure about that

Nova’s arming time: They have a delay before the ability detonates. Because of this, they are nothing more than a deterrent vs any fast-moving fleet. It can be devastating to slower fleets as they can’t dodge everything. I’ll note that during the last patch they changed it to where when your Nova is firing all your weapon systems shut off. This has hurt the matchups vs all the Eldar, especially the Drukari as every volley counts.

Eye of the Omnissiah(EO): This is basically a stasis bomb that you can deploy to an area. The opponent does not know if it’s an EO or a Nova shot.

Nova Saturation: I am convinced that the only way to play Admec is to fill the map with as much Nova as you can. Only 1 Nova cannon can be completely ignored as the shield will absorb the hit, however 5 cannot be ignored as a full volley will mutiny or destroy medium sized ships. This also allows you to make a stasis wall with your EO ability.

Some techniques with Nova Cannons:
EO Wall:
As you guessed, just place all your EO in a line where the enemy is so it blocks them off from you. This will give you 30 seconds to fire at them while they’re zoned away. You then use your admiral abilities for the next zoning phase, then switch back to EO.
The 1-2 punch:
This technique starts with a ranging shot using EO. You place this right at the tip of an incoming enemy ship. If it hits, follow it up with 4 Novas. If it doesn’t, they will have to boost out of the way and then you just start shooting. You can continue to use more EO’s to blanket the area.
Nova Pot Shots
You continuously fire all Novas in sequence as your opponent attempts to dodge them. At a minimum, it will force them to burn their combustion gauge. This is more useful vs slow fleets or people that panic when they see a Nova. This is by far the most common way you’ll see people use the Nova cannons.
Final Send off:
Don’t be shy about using a Nova on a retreating ship or one that’s about to mutiny.

Ships review:

Light Cruisers: Never use a Light Cruiser (LC)
As I stated above, I do believe that Nova saturation is required to effectively play Admec. Taking a LC means less Nova. A LC is normally taken due to its ability to go stealth and use its speed to cap and fight escorts. The Admec LC are the same speed as their cruisers so you gain nothing here. Their weapons are abysmal. The Defiant is the only one that could see play as it’s the cheapest way to get carrier bays. Admec must also stay at range and use lock on. Since they must stay in stealth, they do not get the benefit of the long range playstyle. Their torpedoes only fire 2 shots for some Omnissiah damned reason.

Before we talk about cruisers I first need to talk about their weapons as that’s all that’s different about them.

The Big Lance: 18K range, 18 damage,12 second reload, 1 shot, 9% crit chance, 100% accuracy, on every cruiser as default
Lance Battery: 9K range, 18 damage, 12 second reload, 2 shots, 9% crit chance, 100% accuracy
Macros: 9K range, 18 damage, 12 second reload, 4 shots, 4.5% crit chance
Plasma Macros: 18K range, 15 damage, 12 second reload, 4 shots, 3.75% crit chance

Since your cruisers are going to stay on “Lock On” for as long as possible, I’ll review the weapons under those assumptions.

Lance batteries are 100% accurate and will consistently get crits. A volley from a single battery has a total of 36% crit chance. This is reliable crit damage and it hits with respectable damage.

Plasma Macros have a total of 14% crit chance if everything hits(remember you can’t crit what you miss) and will start firing at 22.5K range with 45% accuracy.

When comparing the lance and macros at 13K range, the lance loses out in raw DPS and but comes away with over 3 times the crit chance . Lances come in at 3 DPS, plasma macros at 3.75DPS(5*.75), and standard macros at 4.5DPS (6*.750) . At shorter ranges the DPS differences just increase further and even more if you switch to reload.

The result is as you would expect it, the macro weapons deal more raw damage at any range but the lances have far higher crit chances. Taking into account armor though, vs heavy armor(83) the lances do almost 2x times the damage than the macros. Lances have about 10% more DPS vs medium armor(67). This is at 13K range still with lock on.

All cruisers have 83/67/67 armor ratings. The 83 rating of the front rarely comes into play as you’re going to be running most of the time. It’s only helpful when you really need to ram something.

Worst Cruiser: Dictator
We are not a carrier fleet. Taking this leaves you with just 2 standard macro batteries. This ship is useless. I have tried it multiple times but found no redeeming factors.

Acceptable Cruiser: Lunar
The Lunar is the “safe” pick if you do not believe you will be able to stay at range and want more overall DPS once they’ve closed the distance on you. The mixed firepower of macros and lances is adequate and it comes in as the cheapest option.

Great Cruiser: Gothic
The Gothic cruiser gets bad rap because of its on-paper lower DPS compared to macro ships. In reality, it’s still interchangeable with the Tyrant in my opinion so far. A broadside volley from a Gothic on Lock On stance has a total of 72% crit chance (not counting the big lazor). 5 Gothics firing will set some ships on fire. These are the best choice vs heavy armor. Focus a Space Marine strike cruiser weapons and he’ll run out of them in no time. One drawback is that the reload stance does not help your ship at all in the DPS department. So you if you must switch to reload for more combustion gauge, then you’re just losing out on crit chance.

Best Cruiser: Tyrant
The Tyrant takes the cake for the most reliable and steady ship. It’s long range plasma macros allow you to start the fight early and get some shots out to drop a shield before a ship gets to you. Once they get closer, your standard macros will pick up the damage and you’ll start punishing ships for chasing you. You also can easily switch to reload stance and get that sweet 60% damage buff to your macro weapons(40% reduction in reload = 60% DPS increase).

The Ark Mechanicus:
Like many other things with Admec, the Ark is a double edged sword. Its DPS is very respectable, outperforming the Tyrant by 28% in broadside damage. It’s main selling point is its Heavy Lance Turret, or Mr. Zappo as I call him. It does 3DPS damage with 22.5% crit chance per volley at 18K range. With lock on you have 45% crit with a single weapon at 22.3K range. Taking into account the lance battery you get another 36% crit, so total 81% crit chance at shot at massive range. It’s speed is the same sluggish 160 as all the Admec ships so you won’t fall behind like other race’s battleships. It’s also got the standard 800 HP shield and 2400 hull points of most battle ships. Being a battleship, it gets 4 charges of any ability it has. It’s super sluggish at 8 degrees rotation speed. Taking the Ark introduces some fleet composition problems that I’ll explain below.

Fleet Compositions:
You can take 5 Lunars, 5 Tyrants, 5 Gothics, or a mix of those 3 cruiser types. This will also allow you to always bring 3 Nova Escort ships with every fleet. You want 5 Nova Cannons to have adequate Nova saturation. Never take the Dictator If you take the Ark, then to keep 5 Nova Cannons you’ll need to take 4 lunars to still have an escort. This is the downfall of taking an Ark in a fleet composition. Also since you have no cruisers under 200 points, you can’t do the common “insert 6 cruisers here” meta build that you often see online.

I’ve already written a guide for admiral skills and fleet upgrades on the forums so I won’t repeat it all. Graded from S-A-B-C-garbage(remove from the game or complete rework)

Admiral Skills:
Supercharged Void Shield:B
Probe: A
Stasis Bomb: S
Disruption Bomb: A
Warp Jump: S
Rad-tempest Device: A
Cybernetica Orb: A
Mechadominator: B

Fleet Upgrades:
Navigational Shields: garbage
Improved Augur Array: garbage
Kastelan Robots: garbage
Aurent-Pattern Weaponries: B or garbage
Disruption Overcharge: C
Mars Pattern Reactor Feeds: garbage
Emission Dissipater: C
Culexus Assassin: S
Armour Piercing Ammunition: B or C
Advanced Void Shield Pattern: C or garbage

Fleet Match-ups:

Imperial Navy: Medium/Hard difficulty. This matchup is completely skill/fleet based. I’ve rolled plenty of IN players and been wrecked by just as many. Their ramming damage and torps volleys means once they get within 4.5K of your ships you’re in trouble. Since their ships are cheaper than yours, you will often be out numbered also. If you don’t cripple at least one of their ships before the close range stuff starts then you won’t last the fight.

Space Marines: Medium/Hard difficulty. Hope that you took Gothic cruisers. If not, it’s going to take forever to beat through their armor. You want to focus their weapons so that you hopefully knock out their boarding torps. If you don’t, you will die to all the boarding. You also can’t run from them so you must wall them off using the EO and stasis bombs while picking through weapon systems.

Admec: Mirror difficulty. Dodge their novas. Hit yours. If you took 5 cruisers and they took 3 cruisers and an Ark, you should have that game. Mirrors are never fun.

Chaos: Medium difficulty. There’s so many different chaos fleets that it’s hard to have one strategy. However if you stick to the long range engagement plan with Nova harassment then you can come out on top. Just beware of the 5 grand cruiser builds with Tzench clouds. That can be rough to deal with.

Corsairs: Medium/Low difficulty. As normal, just don’t panic. Play calmly. Get to the closest 3 points on the map and park there and protect your escorts. Pray for zero clouds and asteroids. Take disruptor overcharge so you can hit their holos. If they ever get with 9K range remember that you can chase these guys down since your repair ability also gives you combustion gauge back.

Asuryani: Medium/Low difficulty. Treat them the same as Corsairs. They’re just tankier but with fewer ships.

Drukari: Medium/Low difficulty. Watch out for Impaler Bays. That is the only viable build right now for Drukari. If you are diligent and run away from the Impalers while waiting for crits from your big lazors, you’ll eventually wear them down. Another trick is to use Mechadominator to “grab” one of their ships after you blow up its bridge and then just ram it. It can backfire since you’re relying on this crit.

Orks: Low difficulty. Slow fleets are what you’re good against. Use the 1-2 punch technique. It works every time since nobody wants to take the first Nova shot. Focus down those escorts. They hurt and you can’t afford your engines to be critted.

Necrons: Low difficulty. You out range them so much and your Novas punish them so hard for using a jump. The 1-2 punch works here every time. The only trick to watch out for is the mass recall bunny hop technique from their LC where they pop up right on your face.

Tyranids: Low difficulty. It’s imperative that you get sight on them ASAP. Take beacon/stasis, and emission dissipator so your escorts can get in range quicker. Use the 1-2 punch technique when you can but be aware that they have double dash so it’s tricky.

Tau: Medium/Hard. Admec fleets do not do well vs carrier fleets. You should be splitting up your fleet when you play Admec but that makes you easy pickings for ordinance. The dreaded Kroot ball builds are also all the rage and you don’t have the DPS to take them down before they catch you most of the time.

What would I change with the Admec? Well thank you for asking.

Firstly before I begin my rant, I’d like to say that the developers did an AMAZING job when they distinguished IN from Admec during that patch. They actually feel different and we now have a purpose to have Admec with the better performing ships(not crew) at a higher price tag. With that said, here we go.

The main issue that holds Admec back from being a truely top tier pick is the mandated Nova cannons. They are such a huge liability that you have to pay for in every match. There is zero surprise as to what you’re going up against every time you que up vs an Admec fleet. No other fleet has this problem to this extent. You will rarely ever use up all 6 shots of your Nova cannons because, try as you might, you will not stop those ships from flying towards you forever. They will eventually catch up, and then the Nova tax you’ve paid for becomes useless. I would love to see some additional ships in any weight class be added that were not forced to take the Nova cannons.

Lore justification? Nova cannons are supposed to be super freaking rare. How does EVERY SINGLE ADMEC SHIP have one of these things? Abaddon's fleets should not stand a chance when 10,000 admec ships with Nova cannons start firing. I will also state that I have not read any of the newer Admec books in the last few years, so I am only guessing there hasn’t been any truly crippling restraints put on them.

Tabletop justification? I admit I never played the tabletop. But from what I’ve researched after spending 5 minutes on google, is that Admec didn’t have their own fleet like the others. So there’s no reason to assume that Admec would have been made with all Nova cannons.

Gameplay justification? I would love to hear the player base opinions on this to make sure it’s not just me, but I do not believe that the majority of people enjoy playing with or against Admec because of the Nova Cannons. They are commonly joked about being the “fun police”. This is party due to the fact that newer players simply don’t know what to do vs them and they panic and get blown apart. As someone who enjoys playing underdog factions(which I adamantly believe Admec is), I so wish every single game didn’t have to start off with a Nova volley.

Some new ship/ability suggestions:
LC Eradicator: Drop the damn useless 2 shot torpedoes, bump the speed up to 200, and give it some macros/lances. Now you’ve got a reason to bring a LC. There is no reason an Admec LC hasn’t figured out how to go as fast as the IN.

Cruiser Dragoon: New ship that specializes in close quarters combat. Same cruiser stat line except 15 troops instead of 9 and does not have the -25 bravery penalty, and has normal boarding values. Armed with 6 light macro batteries.

Cruiser Aegis: New ship that has 4 Launch bays and nothing else. Separate the launch bay ability buttons like the Necron Scourge(we now know it’s possible) so that we can use it as a screening ship vs ordnance.

Cruiser Solaris: New ship that have new torpedo bays. It would shoot a volley of 6-8 standard torpedos or new “gravity” torpedoes. These “gravity” torpedos, if they hit a target, would only do half the damage as a normal torpedo but also put a small stacking 10% debuff on the target’s movement.

Battle Cruiser Termination: A new truely DPS focused ship loaded with plasma macros and heavy lances that would reach out and touch someone at 18K range.

Battle Cruiser Galvaniser: New ship with 4 macro batteries, two top mounted heavy lances, and a torpedo launcher in the prow. Give it a unique ability to “melt” the armor of enemy ships around them(or target?), lowering their armor by 15 for a limited time.

Grand Cruiser Skitarii Dreadnought: Lined with plasma macros and lances, it’s an expensive DPS gunboat that could also have tankier defense in the form of more turrets, troop values, enhanced troop transport(5 instead of 1 troop at a time?)

In the end, you could drop the Nova cannon from every ship, give a torp launcher/more weapons, and call it a different name. This would be a far too simple suggestion I would think though and we’d be missing out on some cool stuff you could do with cybernetic killer robots from Mars.

The Kastelan Robots ability needs to be redone. It needs to matter. Make it affect all line ships and make it some sort of boarding resistance buff.

The mars-pattern reactor: Removes the minimum range of the Nova cannon.

New Static Discharge Ability: Nearby friendly Admec ships periodically “arc” to each other and damage any ships that are in the line. Maybe instead of damage it recharges some shield passively by transferring some to another ship?

Omnissiah Hack: Similar to the Mecha Dominator, but have this one replace lightning strike and transport a “virus” into the ship’s computer system. Make it act like a vicious boarding action with 100% crit that starts blowing up subsystems as the virus tries to tear apart the ship.

You have vortex torpedoes in lore, maybe use those?

I would love to see the communities thoughts on this.

The VI team had been thinking about vortex torpedoes. I like the virus idea and the shield transfer.

Generally, the VI mod has Admech shoot much faster (and had them and SM get better accuracy a long time ago) with a slight dps increase. This makes them better at attacking fast moving targets.

For my own mod version, they now have good boarding, somewhat better side armour and slightly boosted stats and are a bit more expensive than default. I also boosted their range a bit, especially for lances. Their fighters/bombers are also somewhat tougher than regular IN counterparts to make up for the missing assault boats. The ark also has a previously unused Heavy Plasma battery.

Now they can, for example, close and outboard Taus, which both have poor boarding.

@imperator When release or for a long time ??

Ad Mech is strong in a single player game, but at the same time useless in multiplayer, now the weakest faction in multiplayer. The problem is that any player can run away from a Nova shot, unlike a bot that goes to the blast radius itself (because stupid).
I would advise to reduce slightly damage, but significantly increase the shot radius.

@nikof135 I'm not sure. We are waiting on PistonMiner to implement the adding of new ships to the roster without replacing or changing old ones into new ones.

About "Never use a Light Cruiser (LC)" and "We need MORE ships"

@takt said in Vortex torpedo for Ad-Mech:

Original Admech rules say:

  • Endurance and Endeavour l.cruisers can take a single dorsal lance with a range 30 cm (9k in Armada II) instead prow torpedoes;
  • Mechanicus have access to Short Burn Torpedoes, Guided Torpedoes, Seeking Torpedoes, Melta Torpedoes and Vortex Torpedoes.
  • cruisers (no l.cruisers) can take a nova cannon instead prow torpedoes;
  • batteries with a range 30 cm (9k in Battlefleet Gothic: Armada II), can be improved to plasma batteries with a range 45 cm (13,5k in Battlefleet Gothic: Armada II);
  • Mechanicus can use Emperor, Retribution and Oberon battleships;
  • Retribution can take a nova cannon instead prow torpedoes;
  • Skitarii may conduct hit and run raids normaly (lightning strike in Battlefleet Gothic: Armada II)...

Also Lathe-class Monitor-Cruiser and Secutor-class Monitor-Cruiser.

Hey @Myridus

Thanks for this great feedback, it has been passed on to the dev team. 🙂

To be honest, Ad-Mech LCs are quite solid. Just a hair weaker than is required as a truly consistent foundational ship.

They have some of the best DPS available in the game, and can burn long and hard to get into a useful position. With AP ammo, silent running, and reload stance (triggered once you are in range of course), Endeavors can tear apart most cost-equivalent fleets at short range. They are nearly strictly better versions of the IN ship, and for cheaper. They want to be in close, which makes them even better when supported by the powerful nova cannon fire of admech lineships (Macros being better against shields because of how armor effects work).

My biggest problem with ad-mech is that there is just not quite enough point variety in their ships to open up many different builds, as most of their fleets are just minor point differences on cruisers.

Good review , I've been pushing for more significant Admech buffs for a long time after I tried them. A few points I'd like to add.

  • Admech are a long ranged kiting focused faction, that doesn't do long range or kiting well. Their main trope (the Nova) is restricted to a frontal arc so you have to face the foe to use it AND sit completely still for TEN seconds, that's half a stasis bomb duration you're subjecting a ship to. Admech are also slow for a faction that depends on kiting.
    In addition to all this, almost all admech ships can only fire (most of their guns) out to 9k base. The lance turrets are a nice bonus but if Admech is going to be a long ranged faction, the fleets needs to be able to apply more consistent DPS out to at least 13k, without relying on lock on.

  • I don't agree entirely with your analysis of matchups. I believe the only matchup that's even remotely easy for Admech is vs Necrons. This is due to Necrons complete inability to dodge anything more than a single Nova cannon shot if they are used properly. It's also due to the fact that Necrons are total dogshit as a faction at the moment, they are at a disadvantage in any match so it's a somewhat redundant point.
    I believe don't Admech is particularly strong vs Nids or Orks. While Orks have trouble dodging Novas, you rely on them to do enough damage before the Orks catch you. It's hardly an skewed match anyway, once Orks close range you die instantly so Same issue with Nids, but they are better at dodging Novas than Orks.

Admech are designed so much around relying on the Nova, which is a really bad design choice because the Nova is either frustrating to play against, or frustrating to use and we currently see the latter. The advantages it provides are heavily offset by it's extreme awkwardness to use and despite all the fuss, most faction will just dodge it most of the time!
Admech get the Nova as their 1 big advantage as a faction, compared to their enormous disadvantages low troop strength and bad moral their higher damage (which they pay for in points so it doesn't really factor in as an advantage) does not offset all their inefficiencies everywhere else and their huge vulnerabilities.
Admech are just bad, and it does not appear the devs wish to acknowledge this.

@woolypeanut said in A full review of Admec, and what we can do with them.:

than a single Nova cannon shot if they are used properly. It's also due to the fact that Necrons are total dogshit as a faction at the moment, they are at a disadvantage in any match so it's a somewhat redundant point.
I believe don't Admech is particularly strong vs Nids or Orks. While Ork

Admech also has the most powerful AoE command skills in the game. Between these skills and the capacity to snipe out the orc flagship, admech is pretty good against orc.

The positioning is sufficiently demanding though that I feel they have real problems vs nids.

I would never consider a Carrier Useless. When ordnance actually becomes useful i can see many fleet atleast bringing one light or heavy carrier.

But yeah in its current iteration every carrier for all factions are more or less useless compared to a macro boat.

@woolypeanut said in A full review of Admec, and what we can do with them.:

Admech are just bad, and it does not appear the devs wish to acknowledge this.

Admech are not bad, just one trick pony. Even orcs and nids have more options.
@canned_f3tus said in A full review of Admec, and what we can do with them.:

But yeah in its current iteration every carrier for all factions are more or less useless compared to a macro boat.

In the first part of the game was the same. A bunch of macro gave a greater effect than few flight decks.

@myridus said in A full review of Admec, and what we can do with them.:

What would I change with the Admec? Well thank you for asking.

Very interesting stuff here. Im going to implement some of it to my upcoming mod version. Might go with removing several of the current Nova cannons on various ships accross the board and instead buff it alot. I litterally had 25 Nova cannon volleys in a test-game last night. Rather than having a shit-ton of weak blasts, Im going to remake it into a rare- but VERY powerfull weapon. Admech will have more than the Imperial forces, but I intend to make this a expensive brutal weapon.

Will boost Admech weapons/abilities/stats instead to counter the loss of Nova spam.

Thanks for the good insights.

I think the devs need to figure something out for the Ark mechanicus. And light cruisers,

Maybe give LC a special high damage vortex torp and the arch mechanicus could get Regenerative abilities to assist the fleet.

Those are just some of my ideas.