PTS Update 6.0, wrong priorities again...

Devs... C'mon... How could you guys do this misstake again...

Yet again... You prioritized on the wrong stuff...

Instead of working on more bug/problem fixes, you worked on a frickin useless map-making modding toolΒΈ(Who does even care about that anw, the game isn't even close to a "stable" release)...
At this time, giving priority to this kind of stuff is just SO disapointing and irritating for us, as we deal with all those annoying bugs...
You should put the highest priority on fixing bugs, helping us having fun playing...
Then Adding actual useful function, as In-game Co-Op communication
Then Adding new content as they just did for the Season Pass...
After, maybe optimizing the game

And LAST OF ALL optionnal sfuff, as modding tools...

Personnal thoughs:
This game doesn't even needs mods...
One of my friend tested some and he said that most of them are only good to screw up a savegame, or even the entiregame->forced re-stalling...
It's for lemming trolls who are too lame to play with legit in-game content...
I looked at the mods, and nothing is even close to useful or almost interesting...

Cheers...

last edited by Addict2SimsQc

Dude, relax.

Fixes definitely will come.

But do you understand that each person inside of the dev team might have different area of responsibilities?
It's not possible that in one hundred people team each and every one of the dev would be fixing bugs? Some fixing bugs, other create new maps for upcoming dlcs, other creating new mechanics etc.

Yet...

The actual facts speaks for the situation:

  • They're supposed to have fixed 4 bugs (along 10+ new, frickin useless changes/additions),

  • They didn't fix any of the VERY annoying bugs, and worse, they created new ones!...

  • The pedals still interfere with mouse movements...

  • FFB is barly better...

  • Cranes are STILL very easy to bug out to hell...

New bug/glitch I just discovered, with the change made to cranes supports:
We have to activate the support/anchor twice to put it on ground(only the american PROFCRANE works in fact), and WORSE, the small cranes support aren't even deploying...(WHAT THE F**K)
The support/anchor sound loops with no end as soon as we activate it once... (How incompetent is this?)
Edit: Youtube video
Here's the reason why I'm getting very irriated...

last edited by Addict2SimsQc

It's almost as if different team members work on different things, those things get completed at different times, and it would be pointless to throw the entire team at a handful of bugs regardless of their individual fields of expertise.

Bugs take time to fix, and it's not simply a case of heaping manpower on a problem. Someone who knows that particular system needs time to work it out. You could stick 20 people on a single bug, and it could very well take longer to fix, as everyone treads on everyone elses' toes, than if you just left one guy the task.

Ever heard the expression "Too many chefs spoil the broth"?

(Edit: ah, pretty much as @shoushpancheek already said above πŸ˜›)

last edited by grimdanfango

@grimdanfango said in PTS Update 6.0, wrong priorities again...:

It's almost as if different team members work on different things, those things get completed at different times, and it would be pointless to throw the entire team at a handful of bugs regardless of their individual fields of expertise.

Bugs take time to fix, and it's not simply a case of heaping manpower on a problem. Someone who knows that particular system needs time to work it out. You could stick 20 people on a single bug, and it could very well take longer to fix, as everyone treads on everyone elses' toes, than if you just left one guy the task.

Ever heard the expression "Too many chefs spoil the broth"?

Ha! Your quote of the expression tells exactly what I think of their dev team!
They're actually breaking the game, making it worse by doing useless changes...

Cheers

@Addict2SimsQc
Errm... working on the map editor they promised to release alongside the first expansion, and the expansion content that a lot of people already paid in advance for doesn't strike me as useless.

Considering how easy it is to just communicate in MP using Skype, or Teamspeak, or Discord, or countless other alternatives... it strikes me as a little pointless to focus on integrating such a system into the game at the expense of things that can't be done using a 3rd party solution.

@grimdanfango said in PTS Update 6.0, wrong priorities again...:

@Addict2SimsQc
Errm... working on the map editor they promised to release alongside the first expansion, and the expansion content that a lot of people already paid in advance for doesn't strike me as useless.

Considering how easy it is to just communicate in MP using Skype, or Teamspeak, or Discord, or countless other alternatives... it strikes me as a little pointless to focus on integrating such a system into the game at the expense of things that can't be done using a 3rd party solution.

Are you reading yourself before posting?
---Quote---
working on the map editor they promised to release alongside the first expansion, and the expansion content that a lot of people already paid in advance for doesn't strike me as useless.
---quote---
They can't even fix bugs without creating new ones...
Why the hell they waste dev ressources on useless stuff then?
They should kick some butts in their teams... And begin working on the right stuff without breaking the working ones...

---Quote---
Considering how easy it is to just communicate in MP using Skype, or Teamspeak, or Discord, or countless other alternatives... it strikes me as a little pointless to focus on integrating such a system into the game at the expense of things that can't be done using a 3rd party solution.
--- Quote---
What the hell... When playing on a public game to help a a random player, you don't want to have to use a 3rd party comm soft. 😀
How could we add ourselves if we can't even text-chat in the game? πŸ€”

πŸ‘Ώ πŸ‘Ώ πŸ‘Ώ

@Addict2SimsQc
Okay, fair enough, given the specific way you like to play the game - multiplayer and on random people's games - it would admittedly be useful.

But you're ranting on the grounds that all the things a LOT of other people consider important and essential are in fact useless, because you personally have no interest in them.

Well, guess what, a lot of people have no interest in what you consider a priority, because a lot of us (I'd hazard a guess and say most of us) don't play multiplayer in random people's games... a lot don't play multiplayer at all.

So yes, inbuilt chat is something that would be a good addition, but so are all the things that you're writing off as useless.
As with everything, it's likely not a simple thing to implement, and it'll come when it comes.

@grimdanfango

Man... Read my first post right...

I listed the logical way to maintain any software... I am not a dev myself, but I have a friend who's actually working in a software business, and that's the usual priority order in that domain, that I adapted to the situation...

And apparently, I'm not the only one thinking that way, I've read other posts supporting my point, that bug-fixes should be the 1rst priority...

😀

@Addict2SimsQc
And again, we come full circle. Not every developer can be working on bugs, because they aren't all the ones who even worked on the code-base for the parts of the game the bugs are in, and would add nothing to the bugfixing process, given that it'd take months for them to even become familiar enough with the code to understand it.
Someone's probably been working full time on the level editor for months or years. Why would they get pulled off that and moved onto an area they have zero experience in? Just because a bunch of internet forum people told them they should?

A developer has priorities, sure... it doesn't have a single priority. They don't work out a single, linear list of bulletpoints, and work their way down them one by one. That's not the way any company works, unless it's a 1-man company.

last edited by grimdanfango

@grimdanfango

Well said, I kinda see your point about the "overall situation"...

But... if they were doing their things in the right order, we would still be in PTS 5.5-5.6...

I gotta point the fact that they released the map editor in Alpha version, not even Beta...
It could've been released later, after more in-depth dev'ing and making sure it's ready to use by dumb-home-users (and/or) incompetent modders...
A friend of mine said something that Devs must always work for:
You must always think that your software's by the worst users, who is dumb, blind and goofy.

Releasing the DLC stuff is the most irritating in this update...
Why the hell working on additionnal content, when there are countless bugs to fix in the base game?
I don't see how content-creation devs apparently can't work on debugging this very same content...
Or WORST:
They can't even create new content without bugging other content?
Here's the 1M$ question...
😡

πŸ˜’

@Addict2SimsQc
Wasting their time with the editor... what do you think what programm the dev-team uses for their maps? πŸ˜‰
Since I'm working with this "Alpha" editor at the moment I can tell you that the editor is nearly the same as it has been since the early days of Spintires- updated, changed to the new features and engine that are used by Snowrunner but all in all it's the same programm and it's working fine (still very complex and time consuming tho).

I know it seems like they waste their time with an editor while the game has still many bugs. But creating vehicles and maps takes a lot of time and modders need to learn to work with the new tools. Creating a new AAA map can take weeks to months- so it's very good that we can start learning and working on our maps.

Calm down. Mods are really useful addition tho the game (I actively use new trucks from mods for example, no crashes / bugs whatsoever). It's awesome when you are not limited to the vanilla stuff or paywall dlc stuff only.

I was also looking forward for the custom maps support, and it's really good that we have it now, so we'll be able to use new maps as well soon (previous Spintires games has a lot of interesting maps from modmakers).

And bugs in this version are pretty understandable since the purpose of this branch is to find and eliminate bugs.

If you want more stable experience - use stable branch and wait for stable release of 6.0.

@Addict2SimsQc said in PTS Update 6.0, wrong priorities again...:

Devs... C'mon... How could you guys do this misstake again...

Yet again... You prioritized on the wrong stuff...

Instead of working on more bug/problem fixes, you worked on a frickin useless map-making modding toolΒΈ(Who does even care about that anw, the game isn't even close to a "stable" release)...
At this time, giving priority to this kind of stuff is just SO disapointing and irritating for us, as we deal with all those annoying bugs...
You should put the highest priority on fixing bugs, helping us having fun playing...
Then Adding actual useful function, as In-game Co-Op communication
Then Adding new content as they just did for the Season Pass...
After, maybe optimizing the game

And LAST OF ALL optionnal sfuff, as modding tools...

Personnal thoughs:
This game doesn't even needs mods...
One of my friend tested some and he said that most of them are only good to screw up a savegame, or even the entiregame->forced re-stalling...
It's for lemming trolls who are too lame to play with legit in-game content...
I looked at the mods, and nothing is even close to useful or almost interesting...

Cheers...

so, lets talk, lets be serious here and have a did you know session....
did you know mod support has been improved 10fold across the board (only mods you install manually in the Initial. pak have a chance of breaking the game "based off my own personal experiences").......
did you know, "Optional stuff and modding tools" not only help modders create mods....they can also allow modders to find bugs related to the engine, which can fix issues with the base game (i reported 2 or 3 game breaking bugs back in the Mudrunner day because i liked to mess around with the editor and managed to find them)......
did you know, Most companies answer to their shareholders, and that releasing more content for a game is more important than ease of use features (like coop chat support and game optimization for a game that doesnt run awful).....
did you know, theres a 50% chance that the server desync issue isnt something saber can fix, epic might also be to blame (im not gonna blaming epic because there is still a chance it could be on sabers side)
did you know the whole company of saber has an estimate of 600 people spread across 5 different locations, and each of those 600 people have their specific tasks (some may only work on sound, some may only work on level design, some may only work on truck modeling).....
did you know, as far as i cant tell, there is NO Q&A team, meaning the PTS and the forums are how they learn about bugs and fix them
Did you know, complaining the game is a buggy mess without actually saying what bugs you are experiencing has a 0% chance to get your specific bugs fixed due to the reason listed above

last edited by FearedFox18

stop talking to him...this nasty person can be useful in finding bugs and he can make comparison now/before, so let him test)

@Stazco said in PTS Update 6.0, wrong priorities again...:

stop talking to him...this nasty person can be useful in finding bugs and he can make comparison now/before, so let him test)

First of all... I'm not a nasty person...
I'm 38, and I've been gaming for about 20 years ...
SO about games, I Think I can tell when a game's is badly maintained...
And I got pretty good to find bugs...

Talking about bugs in PTS... I found a VERY disconcerning one that threw me down my chair...

They found a way to get the game Worse than it was: They created a bug where there was none!!!!! The cranes supports are now messed up and almost unuseable...

I also found a few more and doing my best to document them before posting it...

@FearedFox18 .... Ok... I see now why this game developpement is going so bad... A game wihout QA team???? First time I ever, EVER, seen it...
So if I understood correctly, US, the frickin players ARE the QA Fckin TEAM????
God Damn... They should pay(##$$ for a documented and confirmed bug) all players who find and report bugs!!!! I'd dedicate every single free moments I have, and these times I have a lot, to do it!!!
πŸ€‘ 😈

@Ada I purchased the game in mid-may, and looked at a huge number of mods since then and as far as I've seen yet, I found only 2 of them that are actually really usefull... the "crane socket for trucks) and the "Azov5319 Evakuador"... And yet, I haven't had to use it yet...

I guess it really depends on how you play the game; Realisticly, driving carefuly, or "Full metal Jacket"/Pedal on the floor/Lee-Roy-Jenkins...
The second type, I don't get why you even play this game... There's plenty of games that are more fun and better fit for you... 😈

Me and my friends, we're the first type that's why we don't need mods...

@DerEggen said in PTS Update 6.0, wrong priorities again...:

@Addict2SimsQc
Wasting their time with the editor... what do you think what programm the dev-team uses for their maps? πŸ˜‰
Since I'm working with this "Alpha" editor at the moment I can tell you that the editor is nearly the same as it has been since the early days of Spintires- updated, changed to the new features and engine that are used by Snowrunner but all in all it's the same programm and it's working fine (still very complex and time consuming tho).

I know it seems like they waste their time with an editor while the game has still many bugs. But creating vehicles and maps takes a lot of time and modders need to learn to work with the new tools. Creating a new AAA map can take weeks to months- so it's very good that we can start learning and working on our maps.

Hey, can you still say that, after you found out yourself that the editor isn't working as it should? 😈

Cheers

last edited by Addict2SimsQc

@Addict2SimsQc
ok!)

please find more bugs!
i appreciate this job! thx!)
pts5 was quite silent, with only 3-5 ppl really active

You got me! 😬
This is a small problem (I'm not even sure if it's me or the editor) and nothing compared to the problems the game has.

For comparison, in the Mudrunner editor, my terrain causes 25 error messages that I had to edit and correct one by one - in the new editor, no errors appear at all! Zero!! 0.00!!! What a relief!!!!

So you can understand why I am very forgiving about such small errors πŸ˜€

@Stazco said in PTS Update 6.0, wrong priorities again...:

@Addict2SimsQc
ok!)

please find more bugs!
i appreciate this job! thx!)
pts5 was quite silent, with only 3-5 ppl really active

I'm not sure I'm gonna keep doing it for long... Seeing how incompetent the devs are and how many more(already found a bunch) I might find, I fear I'll have to send them an hefty invoice for my services...

Me and my friends whith whom I spoke last night, are not sure we'll keep playing this game long if they don't review and change the way they do things....

They are litterally laughing at us, players, thinking they'll get away with this...

@Jellyfoosh !!! I'm telling you guys This: STOP THINKING THAT PLAYERS ARE DUMB AND WILL KEEP PLAYING THIS GOD DAMN BROKEN GAME MUCH LONGER !!!! TELL UR DAMN DEV TEAM TO BEGIN DOING THEIR SHIT RIGHT FAST !!!!

I'd like to see more pressure on them from the community, we MUST unite so they get their shit right, and fast...

last edited by Addict2SimsQc

Hey @Addict2SimsQc, I'd like to address some of the points you raise in this thread, because I understand your frustration, but I'd like to clarify some things.

If the PTS came before the consoles hotfix, it is not because one was prioritized over the other, since they are being worked on simultaneously, as others in the thread have mentioned.

The PTS exists not to test features from scratch, but to expose them to a much larger number of players who all have different configurations and setups. It's also to get general feedback, not just technical. It lets the dev team work much quicker than usual, trying new fixes, etc. The PTS allows for more time and a more thorough understanding of what needs to be fixed/changed before it goes live.

Let me also say that yes, there is a QA team.

The team is always working hard to fix bugs, you can be assured of that, and I understand that it's frustrating when you run into a bug and see an announcement which is unrelated.

Nobody is laughing at you, trying to "get away" with anything, they're just working hard on cool new content and fixes. πŸ™‚

I've locked this thread now, but I suggest in the future that you communicate in a less aggressive way on the forums.

Thanks.