question about inaccurate pass and diving catch

Hi guys
A quick question. I played a game with kislev and i tried to upgrade a guy via a pass to a catcher. The thrower did 2 inaccurate pass ( inaccurate RR inaccurate) BUT the ball was caught by the catcher thanks to a diving catch skill. There was no turn over and the pass was completed (succesfully?) . As the thrower did not receive any spp for pass completion i wanted to know if it was normal due to inaccurate pass or if it is a bug ?

last edited by dragonloup

This is normal. The SPP is only gained for an accurate pass which is caught. Since the pass was inaccurate there was no SPP award, but since the ball ended up in your player's hands there was no turnover.

It is what i thought . I just needed confirmation as i never encountered that situation . Thank you for the quick response
DRGNLP

The spp and the turnover are two different things.

To get the spp, you have to have the ball thrown accurately, and caught by the intended player. (This should work even if he misses teh initial catch, scatters to another player, who misses, and it scatters back to the original, who now catches it. I have not actually tested this fringe event though)

To avoid a turnover, all that has to happen is the ball has to end up in a player on your team's hands. Whether thats because it scatters 3 times and a different player catches it, or it misses and bounces into the players hands and he gets it, or if the initial catcher misses and it scatters to another catcher who succeeds, or diving catch, or some crazy combo of events... as long as it ends in a players hands who is on your team, no turnover. (not tested the limits of the programming... for throw ins and such))

From the rulebook

If a ball thrown by a player isn’t caught by a player from the
moving team, this causes a turnover and the moving team’s turn
ends. The turnover does not take place until the ball finally
comes to rest. This means that if the ball misses the target but is
still caught by a player from the moving team, then a turnover
does not take place. The ball could even scatter or bounce out of
bounds, be thrown back into an empty square, and as long as it
was caught by a player from the moving team then the turnover
would be avoided!

last edited by Gatorlover

@Gatorlover said in question about inaccurate pass and diving catch:

To get the spp, you have to have the ball thrown accurately, and caught by the intended player (on his first attempt, with or without reroll)

This is incorrect - to get the SPP the throw has to be accurate and the ball caught by A receiver (the the passers team) in the targeted square, but it doesn't have to be on their first attempt. As long as the ball comes to rest in the targeted square in the hands of the a receiver from the same side (however it got there) then the SPP is awarded (Blood Bowl rules, not tested on the game).

"Completions (COMP): A player who makes an accurate pass that is caught by a receiver from his own team in the targeted square of the pass when the ball comes to rest earns 1 Star Player point. This is called a completion."

last edited by Darkson

Completions (COMP): A player who makes an accurate pass that is caught by a receiver from his own team in the targeted square of the pass when the ball comes to rest earns 1 Star Player point. This is called a completion.

There is only one receiver in that square, and him catching it is required to get the spp

rtfm indeed.

I had thought i had editted the mistaken part about it needing to be his first try, and have pushed through the edit.

But it absolutely has to be the player it was thrown to to get the spp, at least by the rules.

last edited by Gatorlover

It doesn't have to be on the first attempt, though, which was his point. You stated it needed to be on the first attempt and that's not the case.

The first catch roll (and reroll) can fail, the ball can bounce away from and back to the intended receiver who may then succeed. If this happens the SPP is awarded. If the ball comes to rest in any other teammate's hands then it is not a turnover but no SPP are awarded.

@dode74 said in

The first catch roll (and reroll) can fail, the ball can bounce away from and back to the intended receiver who may then succeed. If this happens the SPP is awarded.

I m sorry i m getting lost with that last answer. I fail to see the logic behind awarding spp for pass completion. If as stated the ball bounce (so in other word possibly touch the floor ?) i assume the pass was inacurate in the first place so why would he get the spp (?) when in my case the pass was also inaccurate and got in the end of the intended player but he caught thanks to his diving catch skill. So here my question what define an accurate pass? If this is passing the ball to an intended target then i should have received spp , if the pass from the thrower need to be accurate to be consider as succesful then i don t understand why a bounce could generate spp. There is a major loophole in the logic in my eye. Again i m happy to follow any rule but i like a bit of consistency in the logic for my own sanity

last edited by dragonloup

@Gatorlover said in question about inaccurate pass and diving catch:

Completions (COMP): A player who makes an accurate pass that is caught by a receiver from his own team in the targeted square of the pass when the ball comes to rest earns 1 Star Player point. This is called a completion.

There is only one receiver in that square, and him catching it is required to get the spp

rtfm indeed.

I had thought i had editted the mistaken part about it needing to be his first try, and have pushed through the edit.

But it absolutely has to be the player it was thrown to to get the spp, at least by the rules.

Wrong - as per the wording from the rules YOU quoted - there is no such thing as an "intended receiver", all that matters is that it is caught in the "targeted square". Most of the time this will be the receiver who was there originally, but there are skill interactions that can end up with a different receiver (from the same side) being in the square when the ball lands and/or bounces back - it's rare (I've seen it once in 100s of games, and I can't recall the specifics, but I think there was combination of Pass Block, Diving Tackle and a couple of Shadowing players - it was a high TV PBeM league, and not my teams, I was the admin) but it can happen, and if it does it still gives SPP, even if the receiver has changed.

So yes, RTFM indeed.

last edited by Darkson

@dragonloup said in question about inaccurate pass and diving catch:

I m sorry i m getting lost with that last answer. I fail to see the logic behind awarding spp for pass completion. If as stated the ball bounce (so in other word possibly touch the floor ?) i assume the pass was inacurate in the first place so why would he get the spp (?) when in my case the pass was also inaccurate and got in the end of the intended player but he caught thanks to his diving catch skill. So here my question what define an accurate pass? If this is passing the ball to an intended target then i should have received spp , if the pass from the thrower need to be accurate to be consider as succesful then i don t understand why a bounce could generate spp. There is a major loophole in the logic in my eye. Again i m happy to follow any rule but i like a bit of consistency in the logic for my own sanity

The pass was accurate but the catch was failed. The pass was eventually caught in the intended square so SPP are awarded.

An accurate pass is one where the pass roll is successful, as defined in the rulebook, and gives a +1 to the catch roll. The catch roll is nothing to do with the pass being accurate.

There are plenty of logical loopholes with passing - rolling to intercept first, for example - but that's how it's defined.

There are two conditions needed for a pass to give an SPP:

#1 Was the pass (roll) Accurate?
#2 Was the ball caught in the targeted square?

Condition #1 is not affected by condition #2, and nowhere in the rules does it say that #2 has to follow directly from #1 - the ball can be dropped, bounce, dropped some more, go off the pitch and be thrown in by the crowd - it doesn't matter.

Thank you for clarifying
I learnt something interesting

@Darkson said in question about inaccurate pass and diving catch:

@Gatorlover said in question about inaccurate pass and diving catch:

Completions (COMP): A player who makes an accurate pass that is caught by a receiver from his own team in the targeted square of the pass when the ball comes to rest earns 1 Star Player point. This is called a completion.

There is only one receiver in that square, and him catching it is required to get the spp

rtfm indeed.

I had thought i had editted the mistaken part about it needing to be his first try, and have pushed through the edit.

But it absolutely has to be the player it was thrown to to get the spp, at least by the rules.

Wrong - as per the wording from the rules YOU quoted - there is no such thing as an "intended receiver", all that matters is that it is caught in the "targeted square". Most of the time this will be the receiver who was there originally, but there are skill interactions that can end up with a different receiver (from the same side) being in the square when the ball lands and/or bounces back - it's rare (I've seen it once in 100s of games, and I can't recall the specifics, but I think there was combination of Pass Block, Diving Tackle and a couple of Shadowing players - it was a high TV PBeM league, and not my teams, I was the admin) but it can happen, and if it does it still gives SPP, even if the receiver has changed.

So yes, RTFM indeed.

The intended reciever is the one standing in the targeted square... this is pretty common language, and you are just being childish now. There is a fringe case where the reciever is no longer in the square but still standing (shadowing)... but that invovles a retarded passing player who intentionally leaves the square he is throwing to.

And no, you haven't seen it. Because seeing it would involved the stupidity of the pass blocking player to move into the targetted sqaure, and then move back OUT again with a shadowing player near him. That simply isn't ever going to be a strategically intelligent move, and so its literally never going to happen.

What you mean by "i've seen it": is "its theoretically possible" but it doesn't happen. ever. not 1/100. never. Because it it requires both two players playing very poorly and getting lucky anyway.

It doesn't have to be on the first attempt, though, which was his point.

I know, and thats the mistake i had thougth I had already edited.

last edited by Gatorlover

No, I mean I've seen it - just because you've been shown to be wrong doesn't mean you get to call me a liar.

@Darkson

I called you a liar because you are one.

Not only have you not seen it, no one has, because the level of bad play required to make it happen is ridiculous.

You've seen its theoretically possible, so decided, like most of your kind, to claim you saw it. You didn't. it never happened. to make it work requires so much bad play by BOTH players combined with lucky rolls I'd bet my life savings its never happened in an actual match. ever. under any circumstances. it involves the active team diving tackling or shadowing OUT of the target square, the pass blocker moving into and then back out of the square, all while everyone passes every roll. It's bad play for the active team because it relies on worse play from the other team. AND you'd need three players with the right skills, AND a lot of rolls

Maybe by "I've seen it" you really mean "i saw it back with the old diving tackle from the third edition" maybe... because then it only would have required bad play from ONE team. It dioesn't require making a spectacularly bad decision in teh hopes your opponent makes an even worse one that way. (old diving tackle allowed you to throw a block when someone entered your tackle zone as a reaction... with pass block and pushes, THEN it was possible, albeit still rare)

I'm gonna repeat, you have not seen it. And you never ever will, unless you and a friend agree not to play the actual game, but to set it up and do it... and at that point you might as well (like you did) just make it up, because you didn't see it in a real game.

last edited by Gatorlover

Ah, so I'm a liar because you've been proven wrong - good to know.

And no, it wasn't 3rd ed with the old DT, it would have been around the time of the Vault/PBBL that became LRB5, as I was helping admin the PBeM playtesting league in the MBBL.

But I'll happily accept your life savings, thanks.

@Darkson

your a liar because you are lying.

It's ok, you can keep acting like the 12 year old who doesn't understand the difference between theory and reality.

I had misread your initial post (i had read it saying as long as it was accurate, any catcher works)

I admitted i was wrong,. but that doesn't make you less a liar,.

You see, those two things are completely unrelated. you making up an unrealistic scenario has nothing to do with my mistake... it just has to do with you lying.

The event could theoretically happen... if the players are as bad at playing as you are at making up scenarios.

Community Manager

Thanks to stay respectful and constructive. If the topic derails further, it will be locked.

The subject of the topic has been answered by Dode and Darkson. You can lock it

Community Manager

@dragonloup said in question about inaccurate pass and diving catch:

The subject of the topic has been answered by Dode and Darkson. You can lock it

Ok, thanks.

Looks like your connection to Focus Home Interactive - Official Forums was lost, please wait while we try to reconnect.