Back stab isn't 1 shot kill for some reason

I just back stabbed a marksman who was completely oblivious (wearing heavy armor) and after the hit, he turned around and shot me, meaning it didn't 1 shot kill. Is this a bug? or does the heavy armor prevent it from 1 shotting?

I think you're looking for Team Fortress 2.

@mr-grim have you played the first insurgency?

@io543 They aren't basing sandstorm on any past games. So that's irrelevant.

@mr-grim said in Back stab isn't 1 shot kill for some reason:

So that's irrelevant.

What's truly irrelevant is not having a 1 shot kill back stab. The knife is already pretty much irrelevant and a 1 shot back stab would be the only situation I'd see it being used. And that would be so rare already!
Since it doesn't one shot anybody, why would you ever use it? That would be an item completely useless everyone has by default, the devs had to code it, solve bugs about it... And everyone would not even know it's there, because the only situation it could be used in won't work unless it can 1 shot back stab!

I'm all for being 1 shot stabbed in the back. If not, just remove the knife from the game.

last edited by Best Waifu

I agree the knife is worthless right now why should i use it When its not a instant kill a few days i knifed someone from behind and i got shot and he killed me

@best-waifu If armor vests can stop bullets, what makes you think your spaghetti arms will puncture it? I get what you're saying; the weapon is useless. As it was in Ins2, what else can they do to "buff" a knife in a gun fight aside from being unrealistic.

@mr-grim hum, don't you know that bullet armour do not stop knifes? And being right at the back of an ennemy, why not just slit his throat? Yeah, do try to continue fighting with half a neck left...
And it being "realistic" is not relevant as a game needs to be fun! and ffs, as a developer, why would you spend time and effort making a useless weapon?

@best-waifu said in Back stab isn't 1 shot kill for some reason:

as a developer, why would you spend time and effort making a useless weapon?

It's about as silly as the guy thinking a knife in a gun fight would prove any worth.

@mr-grim
says the guy that forgets this game is not real life...

@mr-grim And yes, if you want real world stuff, knifes have been used in situations where a firefight is happening or could happen. They will also continued to be used far after guns disappeared. Why the hell do you think every soldiers gets a knife and training to use it. It's useful as f... in the right situations.

Insurgency 2 also isn't one shot kill with a knife.
I just had it happen to me when I tried to kill someone from behind. He just turned around and killed me. So I understand it isn't in this one too.

@sirpenetrator said in Back stab isn't 1 shot kill for some reason:

Insurgency 2 also isn't one shot kill with a knife.
I just had it happen to me when I tried to kill someone from behind. He just turned around and killed me. So I understand it isn't in this one too.

It's supposed to be, but melee in Ins2 can get a little wonky.

@io543 said in Back stab isn't 1 shot kill for some reason:

I just back stabbed a marksman who was completely oblivious (wearing heavy armor) and after the hit, he turned around and shot me, meaning it didn't 1 shot kill. Is this a bug? or does the heavy armor prevent it from 1 shotting?

The Heavy Armor does stop the one-shot.

In fact, Sandstorm's melee damage model works just like the bullet damage model. Torso hits are only effective against unarmored targets, but aiming for the opponent's head is an instant kill regardless of what direction you hit him from. It's kind of like the Heroes and Generals melee system where headshots always instakill.

That being said, you can perform a melee charge if you melee attack while sprinting. From what I tested yesterday it seems to one-shot an enemy consistently regardless of where you aim or what armor your enemy has.

last edited by MarksmanMax

@MarksmanMax

In fact, Sandstorm's melee damage model works just like the bullet damage model. Torso hits are only effective against unarmored targets. but aiming for the opponent's head is an instant kill

That reminds me of that one time I randomly, on accident, teamkilled someone on our team with my knife because I was aiming at head level and accidentally pressed the LMB too much. (And friendly fire normally takes way more hits than enemies itself)

@sirpenetrator Yeah, there's a TK damage reduction. I haven't actually tested what the percentage, is, though. I should do that later today lmao.

That being said, the damage for headshots is so ludicrously high that it's always a guaranteed TK if you headshot a friendly.

@mr-grim Actually you have several types of body armor.

What the military is using most of the time (in places like Iraq for example) against high caliber rifles like 5.56 and 7.62
is a ceramic vest.

Now a level 4 ceramic vest in theory could stop some slashes or stabs (though it will be broken after a good stab since ceramic vests protect the soldier by that they shatter, absorbing the impact that way, so they actually design to break).

But, the problem with those vests is that you have opening in the sides that you can easily stab through when near the enemy. Kevlar vests are typically against small caliber bullets and are really really bad against knives.

When Kevlar with liquid armor layers will be a thing we can talk again but,
this whole conversation is moot really since if you come to someone from behind you go for the neck anyway

last edited by Bez

@sirpenetrator Ins2 had 1 shot shot back stabs...

@io543 said in Back stab isn't 1 shot kill for some reason:

@sirpenetrator Ins2 had 1 shot shot back stabs...

Not for me when I tried it. I stabbed him but he turned around and shot me in the process.

Independant of the height of the attack ( body or neck ) there should be a kill animation always executed to the neck/throat similar to this
( except that silly dog tag take away animation and the heart stitch which are totaly ridiculous ) :

Youtube Video

Why would somebody try to punch a knife through a ballastic vest which has a much higher resistance instead of attacking the unprotected body parts which lead to immediate loss of control because of the pain and destruction of important organs ( stab into the neck / throat / eye / ear ... and also the kidneys which are unprotected because the lowest edge of the body armor ends at that region).
To hit the heart with a direct hit through the high-class body armor ( which resists rifle ammunition ) AND the ribs ( which are already a good natural protection ) is almost impossible in such a situation -- it´s just Hollywood cinematic bullshit. Many vests also have rectangular steel plates in the region of the heart to protect the operator from trauma caused by kinetic impact energy of high velocity projectiles !

And yes, a knife attack should be a one hit kill !!
A knife-counter attack in Player vs. Player would also be a nice implementation if possible.

Sandstorm shows us the brutal face of war in a very intense and immersive athmosphere. A one hit knife kill should be part of it.
But .. the knife-attack should not be done just by pressing one keyboard-button ( like insta-melee attack in many other games ).
Players should pull out the knife first and only after that it should be useable for close combat.
Just my opinion.

last edited by GSG_9_LIGHTNING

I have been able to get knife kills in one hit by aiming at the head regardless of direction they face.

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