TTK needs a kick up the @#$*

whether its still the good old Hit reg not doing its job or not.
The TTK is ridiculously slow for Insurgency. Insurgency2 was a one-shot for basically everything above .45 acp. SKS and G3 take 3 shots sometimes. All these twats coming in from COD saying the TTK is too fast can leave, this is insurgency, you die instantly to everything no matter what and that's what we want.
"armor needs a buff" can bugger off, have it like old insurgency, armor meant you could soak more shrapnel from explosives and from bullets penetrating. NOT soaking full rifle rounds what the hell. Kevlar ain't made to stop 5.56 or 7.62 its made to stop or slow down pistol bullets and shrapnel. Even if you did get hit by a pistol bullet with Kevlar your body just had to eat the force of a lump of lead moving ar 300+ m/s you gonna be on the ground for a wee while (I guess youed be so jacked of on adrenalin you wouldn't even notice but for lord sakes there should be aim punch at least in game). please for the love of god just replicate Insurgency2's damage models they were loved by many vets and if you want to carry on the name Insurgency its what is required. "it's like battlefield" is how this is being described ffs

The appeal of Insurgency2014 was it's lethality
The appeal of Day of Infamy was it's lethality

Day of Infamy had no AP ammo and had no armor
Insurgency2014 had AP ammo and it had armor

Both had the same lethality
Both had the same appeal

While the mechanics for each game was different it played out the same.
And it was good.

Yet here, in Sandstorm, we don't have the lethality of the previous 2 games which we came to love over 3-4 years and which built up a community

Solution:

  • make the guns more lethal
  • More specifically, make the 5.56 caliber (and above) guns kill in 1 shot (like Insurgency2014) when in close/medium range firefights.

@zucchini I don't understand how people have problem taking down enemy players, when hitreg is working. They drop in under a half second even on semiauto. How is that slow? Yes, it's probably slower than instant kill from the first shot. Only time I have problem taking down opponents is when I'm not hitting (this means my aim, I haven't personally suffered from hitreg issues).

If you're suffering from hitreg issues, that's completely different thing. Gameplay video is needed to confirm that.

I agree that there should be penalty for getting hit (stopping movement / slowing down etc. something like that)

Kevlar sure ain't made for stopping rifle rounds, but modern military combat armor is not just made of kevlar as far as I know (someone who has more knowledge on this please correct, if I'm wrong). If you think about it, military armor is probably designed to stop something heavier than pistol rounds. Why? Because they're most likely to face something else than pistol rounds in combat (like... rifle rounds).

Movement mechanics should be tweaked before weapon damage. After that we see IF weapon damage really is the reason for the frustration of some people and needs tweaking. And I'm pretty sure it's not the root cause.

@jensiii said in TTK needs a kick up the @#$*:

I don't understand how people have problem taking down enemy players

We kill the enemy like the rest of you as any other player would.
What we want is the killing to be more satisfying (like Insurgency2014), as such, increasing the damage of the weapons to kill in 1 shot (like Insurgency2014) will make the gameplay more fun and better (like Insurgency2014).

Ins2014 and DoI, you aimed, you fired, the target fell down.

Sandstorm, you pull the trigger in full auto and hose the long range target down. It's a game of recoil management, there's barely even an advantage to properly aiming before you pull the trigger since you're going to have to manage recoil on the super soaker regardless.

TTK is terrible. Cannot wait until modding support is released so the community can fix it, I guarantee it will be the first mod with 100,000 downloads.

No. Just no.

The devs pretty much confirmed yesterday on stream they are "happy" with the current TTK.

There's nothing "fun" or "satisfying" about low effort kills aka 1-shot-kills (besides bolt snipers). Deal with it.

@whitby you claim that aim doesn't currently matter because you need more than one shot to kill, and still we know that aim always matters more when you need more than 1 shot to kill. We know this because it discussed before on the forum, but back then people were crying about "not wanting the aim to matter that much" and therefore wanted one shot kills. Contradiction anyone?!

I'm getting tired of these TTK crying threads. There's only really one valid argument for one-shot-kills and that is: "I like them more". Don't try to make any gameplay/skill-based arguments other than "I want the game to become easier" because they won't hold up.

Slazenger had good points about weapon balancing on another thread about TTK and said that he just likes one-hit-kills more and that's. And while I don't agree with him about the TTK, he can have his preferences of course.

@Benz I'm happy to hear that devs said that. Is there a record of the stream available somewhere, do you know?

@slazenger I find killing in Sandstorm more satisfying than in INS2.

So again just a matter of preference: one-hit-kills make it more satisfying only if that is your preference. It doesnt make the game objectively more satisfying and fun.

@slazenger yes. so? get gud. Try hitting 2-3 shots instead of 1. What's the problem? 😂

The reason I am even attracted to Sandstorm is due to the lethality people talked about in the game it replaces. Discussions like this worry me to be honest.

I'm on console and have to wait until next year before we get our hands on the game. I really hope they get this dialed in to the point where it will actually feel as deadly as I thought / hope it would be.

@benz
The problem is the argument for high TTK is never beyond "it makes the game more skillful" "git gud"

@jenshii

"I want the game to become easier"

Killing in 1 shot does not make the game easier. You are conveniently forgetting that it also applies to the enemy too, who can kill you in 1 shot. That doesn't make the game easy, it makes it more of a challenge if anything.

I admit, there's was nothing like setting up a defense perimeter on Push with an M14 EBR w/ scope and one shotting people across the smokes trails in Source. I think that in the end, whatever the majority of playerbase thinks that low TTK is best, NWI will follow suit then.

All I want is one shot kill on unarmored target, which actually makes armor more useful at the current stage, but I doubt "muh skill" people will listen or even look at it. The ttk should be same as INS2 without AP rounds. 1 shot for unarmor by all calibers, 1-2shots for light armor, 2-4 shots for heavy armor, I really don't know what is the problem with this suggestion, people just assume I want everything to be 1 hit kill even on heavy armor. The current weight penalty for armor is really good, but needs more on stamina and ads, and light armor/no armor is exact same (2 shots whatsoever)

last edited by ctbear1996

@slazenger yeah, and I don't enjoy low-effort kills. So what?

The devs pretty much confirmed yesterday on stream they are "happy" with the current TTK.

Thanks for the info... 😞

I am very sad to hear this. It means I will likely refund the game at the end of beta. This is not the gameplay that I signed up for. I'm having much more fun with the old INS2 right now, so if Sandstorm stays as it is in regards to TTK, it's not the right game for me.

Hope at least all you (ex)Battlefield players enjoy the game!

@grotesqueshadow There will be tweak to damage and other stuff, they are just happy with the current concept of "time to kill", which is actually fine and short. (maximum 4 shots to heavy armor, most time 1-3 shots)

Why Benz is only interested in TTK topic? Lmao. He seems to very attracted to ttk discussion despite the only thing he would say is "no"

I refunded a long time ago and i keep an eye on forums and such see if they will make this an insurgency game. but they will not. Just a reminder, You can refund on steam no matter how many hours you have during Beta. its the only message we old insurgency fans can give them.

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