TTK needs a kick up the @#$*

@ctbear1996 prob. cuz this ttk-crying-topcis are spreading like shrooms? And yeah..i've already said enough times why i dont want an even lower need to rewrite everything every day.

I'd say the same about you tbh.... makes you think.

@benz Nah, I care the overall gameplay and make suggestions on almost everything, the only place I see you active is these TTK threads, you are obsessed with them, get over it, unless you have some constructive feedbacks there's no need to be salty, right?

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@ctbear1996 stop flamebaiting. its getting annoying.

@croox said in TTK needs a kick up the @#$*:

I refunded a long time ago and i keep an eye on forums and such see if they will make this an insurgency game. but they will not.

same here brother. I refunded few weeks ago and forgot about it. I got back to the forums in hopes that they would listen the community and make it more like Ins2014, but apparentely they didn't. this is very sad, I hate that they are taking the mainstream route. I get that they want to make it more competitive, but I feel stabbed in the back... and I can see I'm not the only one

Modern military armor is not just Kevlar, but metal plates placed in pockets on a "plate carrier" … hence the name.

From the way it looks in game, light armor seems to reflect Type II or Type IIA body armor. This armor stops 9mm, .40, .45 ACP, .357 Magnum rounds (i.e. most sidearms, UZI, knife stabs).

The heavy armor seems to reflect Type III or Type IIIA armor. This armor stops .45 Magnum and 7.62 rounds (i.e. every sidearm, a lot of rifles).

If we were to reflect realism, shots to the chest of an armored target with the above-mentioned calibers would not penetrate. They may stagger the target, cause bruising, or even break ribs, but repeated shots would generally not kill them. Furthermore, shots to targets armored with a lower tier armor than the caliber your firearm is using would go right through the armor. So irl a 5.56 would virtually ignore both of the above-mentioned armors.

AP rounds would also go right through. Some of the weapons in game are specifically designed for special AP rounds (such as the MP7) and would shred through most armors.

Even though the current system is not perfect and not exactly true to life, the general idea that armored targets have more survivability to torso shots is incorporated. I like it much more than ins2 because it is indeed more realistic. Targets tend to soak up a good deal of torso shots if they are armored, forcing the shooter to go for head or extremity shots. This is absolutely realistic. After all the point of armor is to increase survivability, so why shouldn't heavier armored targets have a longer TTK?

If you want ins2's and doi's TTK then go play those games. This is a different game with a feel that I think a lot of us can appreciate: the gunplay and recoil are the most true to life I've ever seen in a game, suppression effects are correctly intense, explosions are of realistic magnitudes.... besides fairly minor things, the game does a good job of feeling like modern infantry combat.

Just a side note: 5.56 rounds are generally not stopped by Type III armor as they are light rounds which are used in firearms with very high velocities. This makes them good at penetrating thin, dense materials, such as body armor. Even though 7.62 rounds are significantly larger, they travel at lower velocities, making them unable to puncture a lot of heavier armor (however their material penetration, such as through wood, is much better).

the more I think about sandstorm and the more I play it I always get frustrated it with no matter what. Shit like TTK in this game is absolutely a joke when compared to day of infamy and insurgency. Even day of infamy didn't have AP/HP rounds and did fine.'

Why slow down the fast paced nature of insurgency/day of infamy when its been well praised for 4 years for insurgency and for 1 year for day of infamy? And yet both of these games have relatively high reviews compared to most games in Steam. Hell, even the beta of day of infamy was alright compared to this. The tension just feels gone in sandstorm. You can get away with so much BS in insurgency sandstorm compared to what you can get away with in Insurgency 2014 and day of infamy. The lack of tension, quick deaths, and the respawn times that insurgency 2014/day of infamy enforced to think more about your life just makes this game feel uninteresting to what it's trying to compete in the market. It's like its identity is crumbling away.

I don't get how people say fast TTK can make the game easy while in Insurgency 2014, a game with a wildly faster TTK than sandstorm, has pro players decimating the shit out of public players with extensive map knowledge and quick reaction times.

Quick reaction times can save your ass sometimes, but knowing specific spots and lanes the enemy use to their objective can objectively make you a monster in a match. What's the point of reducing TTK to make it competitive? Rainbow Six Siege is low TTK and pretty highly competitive. Increasing TTK will basically try to emulate like COD where your chances of survival are increased because you take less damage. What's the point of just increasing TTK to make it competitive?

Certain aspects of sandstorm are lacking on what they tried to improved on their predecessor.

@thehappybub Wasted breath, I'm afraid. They've already convinced the devs to nerf armor to the point that it's basically useless. Light armor does almost nothing, and heavy armor only makes a difference against 9 guns... 3 of which can kill you anyway under the right circumstances.

Those of us who actually like a higher TTK are being completely outvoted by the people who hate it, I'm afraid. I fully expect armor to be nerfed even further to the point it essentially becomes INS:Source again.

@DerpyDays the 1 shot TTK of ins2 and doi was honestly kind of silly to me. Yes the one shot death also applied to the player, but once you played the game for a while and learned the maps and how to juke and slide around, playing anything other than versus actually did feel easy. I mean in ins2 especially checkpoint coop rounds would be comedy. Everyone would immediately vote to turn up the AI to the max brutal setting and then people would hip hop and bounce around getting K:Ds like 200:1.

I agree that there was a feel to it, but it wasn't realistic. From what I'm seeing in sandstorm so far, they're trying to go for realism. You can't jump and cheese your way around the map anymore, you have to stay grounded. The recoil is realistic and you need to control it. I hope that the devs continue down the realism path and don't give in to calls for sandstorm to just become an ins2 clone.

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@quadsword so sad, alexa... play despacito.

@thehappybub why go for realism when insurgency from the start has always been a game thats always been the in-between with COD/Battlefield & Arma? These roots have developed their core fanbase. Why drastically steer away from your roots that made your fans admire so many years and made it revered among the tactical shooter genre on Steam?

Even as someone who plays ARMA 3, SWAT 4, and Ground Branch, I want insurgency to stay the way it is not go towards more to realism. That'll just degrade the fun and competitiveness on what makes Insurgency good to me and my friends. Even my friends that adored Insurgency most of them not even experienced prefer the kind of gameplay Insurgency 2014 have, not what sandstorm is trying to aim towards to.

Insurgency wasn't never made to be realistic, it always has been and will be the middle ground between ARMA and Battlefield/COD. That's always been it's identity from games spanning from Insurgency Modern Combat, Insurgency 2014, and Day Of Infamy.

I get it the developers want something different from Insurgency 2 and I'm all fine of it, but certain game mechanics feel dumbed down and casualized compared to Insurgency 2014, where it's always been intense and lethal deaths were always around the corner.

It's ok for change, even as a insurgency player trying out day of infamy. But sometimes drastic changes that just negatively impact the experience on what made the previous game revered among steam reviews, modders, and veteran players alike just feels wrong on what direction sandstorm is going.

last edited by DerpyDays

They should remove it entirely.

@DerpyDays So CoD/BF is an arcade shooter and Arma/Squad is a milsim (aka running simulator). What I've always wanted was a milsim without all the damn running, just the firefight part. Ins2 came close, but it was not as realistic as I'd hoped. In sandstorm, even though some mechanics are indeed dumbed down (which I'm dissatisfied with ... for example showing ammo count), it does feel more realistic overall.

I get where you're coming from, but I just don't get your argument. If you and your friends want ins2, then play that game. Sandstorm is already revered and NWI seems to be doing a good advertising/hype job. Ins2 gave them cred, but that doesn't mean that they need to keep remaking ins2 over again with newer engines.

@benz I'd rather play It's sequel and successor - Sandstorm

@Slazenger then why do you want Sandstorm to just be the same game on a new engine?


Because the new engine can bring better visuals for me to enjoy, along with the gunplay I enjoy from the previous game (which is absent).

@Slazenger So you do want sandstorm to just be ins2 with better graphics...

In that case I think arguing with you over anything in the game is a moot point.

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@thehappybub said in TTK needs a kick up the @#$*:

So you do want sandstorm to just be ins2 with better graphics...

The devs do too.

@Slazenger I wouldn't speak of what the devs want unless I was one of them. I think what they want first and foremost is to make a game that sells well.

Besides, just like a public company, what the devs want should be highly influenced by what the players want, given that they're the ones that will be paying.

The devs are in a tough position, they either alienate people like you or people like me. It seems this will come down to who there's more of.

last edited by thehappybub